Please use this thread for off-topic, but preferably BBC related, comments. Please keep comments on other threads to the topic at hand. N.B. this is not an invitation for general off-topic comments – our aim is to maintain order and clarity on the topic-specific threads. This post will remain at or near the top of the blog. Please scroll down to find new topic-specific posts.
Open thread – for comments of general Biased BBC interest:
Bookmark the permalink.
Gloating Beeboid seems to have forgotten that even Fox badges itself as “fair and balanced.” It also has a sprinkling of lefty presenters to “balance” the rather larger number of non lefties.
I’m afraid I’ve never watched 18 Doughty Street, but if you’re going to hire a lefty presenter, then the Tatch would seem to be quite a good choice. He does at least appear to have a mind of his own, rather than just parroting standard progressive dogma.
I loved the reference to “pure commercial poison” by the way – a Beeboid would really know all about surviving in the tough commercial world, ie getting viewers to pay for your offerings.
Gloating Beeboid | 14.04.07 – 11:27 am |
Welcome my sub-bridge dwelling friend.
You, as with many of your komrades miss the point. I, and I suspect many others here, want to hear left wing views – anyone interested in politics would.
What we don’t want is to hear only left wing views or only right wing views for that matter.
Campaigning against bias means having to listen to all sides, not just one.
But I wouldn’t expect a beeboid to understand that.
Has anyone heard any more about the Algerian asylum seeker and her baby who were attacked in Scotland ? (Today programme last Thursday).
The BBC is Rotten From Top to Bottom
http://the-daily-pundit.blogspot.com/2007/04/bbc-is-rotten-from-top-to-bottom.html
Lee Moore | 14.04.07 – 12:21 pm
– a Beeboid would really know all about surviving in the tough commercial world
Well, one who’d started off at Granada, migrated to Thames, did a short spell at Central TV before jetting off to Viacom in the States for 3 years would know quite a bit about it, yeah.
The BBC stopped being staffed by civil servants way back when, believe it or not.
Sorry, GB – what drove viewers away from 18 Doughty St is far more likely to have been the self-referential ‘after you, Claude, no, after you, Cecil’, incestuous waffling of a handful of self-important young bloggers.
Whatever they (or you lot at the BBC) like to think, blogs are still pretty small beer in the UK and hyped out of all proportion to their importance.
If, as you claim, it was the politics that deterred the viewing hordes, how do you explain the vastly greater circulation of the Telegraph over that of your house organ, the Guardian, eh?
pickwick -> try here:
http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&tab=wn&ncl=1115275913
“GCooper | 14.04.07 – 1:03 pm ”
i didnt watch it too often either as i digest all my daily news via RSS, blogs and podcasts (mostly American). the “after you cecil” style was a bit off putting alright – i expected something a bit meatier.
The BBC stopped being staffed by civil servants way back when, believe it or not.
Gloating Beeboid | 14.04.07 – 12:56 pm
Not.
archduke writes:
‘…i expected something a bit meatier.’
As did I. In fact I felt quite uncomfortable watching it. It was like having gatecrashed the Islington dinner party of a coven of apprentice lawyers.
Oh well… that’s me banned from the comments section of most UK blogs 😉
any questions , radio 4
peter hain: orange skinned leftist
cheryl gillan: token tory
adam price: plaid cymru. left wing
lembit opik: crazy name, crazy guy. Lib Dim. leftist.
“GCooper | 14.04.07 – 1:18 pm”
no your right. i was very uncomfortable with it at times as well… felt like an outsider “looking in”.
i dont know how the likes of say, Hugh Hewitt in the U.S. does it – but when i listen to him, i actually feel PART of his world/discussion. even though he’s a Christian rightie American, and i’m more of a Libertarian atheist Brit.
maybe its the class system in Britain rearing its ugly head – and it surfaced on Doughty street. you just dont get a feeling of that “class” thing on American talk radio..
just my two cents on this.
g.b
The moral of this story is: the sorts of opinions and worldview that characterize this blog have turned out to be pure commercial poison.
and the fact your lot did so well
at the Television Society journalism awards says a lot about you as well.
Stuck-record | 14.04.07 – 9:26 am
John Humphrey’s spluttering with moral indignation .. presume that Mr Humphrey’s — in line with other major BBC figures — would be paid a minimum of £500,000 a year.
Plus his wealth & income derived from his 1.5% stake in YouGov. A stake obtained for no cost in exchange for lending his BBC cred to regular BBC guest, Peter Kellner’s enterprise.
Ben writes:
“The moral of this story is: the sorts of opinions and worldview that characterize this blog have turned out to be pure commercial poison.”
I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave earlier.
If you are right, how do you explain the miserable circulation figures of the Guardian as opposed to those of the Telegraph ?
Is there any chance of an answer, or are you another output-only device?
“The BBC stopped being staffed by civil servants way back when, believe it or not.”
Sorry mate……Gordon Borwn and Blair decide who is your boss……and your wages are paid by tax…
Your’e no better than any other council employee…or in other words, you can’t make it in the real world, so have to leach of others……and those who work at the BBC who do have talant, end up leaving and going to the States or ITV….lol. Rowan Atkinson, Ricky Gervais…etc..
And your’e left with 80s Thatcher Children like Dawn French and Lenny (Not been funny in 20 years) Henry……lol.
Thats why you get 5 Million for a “good” show now….where it used to be 25 Million……the BBC is shrinking and dying, and no amount of bleating from the hysterical and blind left is going to change it………good riddence. lol.
Quite simply…the BBC is obsolete…..Old Empire Propaganda Garbage the world could and soon will do without. 🙂
The interesting thing (to me anyway) is why Beeboids need to gloat. Do staff at Tesco crow when a small on-line organic food delivery service decides to stock non-organic food as well? I doubt it.
Of course comparing the BBC with Tesco is probably wrong, perhaps Iceland is more like it.
BTW…I notice the BBC is playing Gordons running to the USA to meet with GW Bush, as George begging for Gordon to come over…..
When the fact is, the reason Gordon got on a plane and flew over to meet GWB, is becasue GBW said “Here Boy”, gave a few whistles…and Brown came running……
I mean, if Bush was desperate to meet Brown, HE would have got on a plane and gone to all the trouble…….
But no…Brown dropped everything, in the run up to Local Eelctions……..and ran to his master as ordered…..
Stop telling porkies Beeb……we know Labour are slaves to GWB, and we know you are slaves to Brown…..no one believes you when you talk about Brown…we know your tounge is up his arse, he picked your boss FFS. lol
Go do as your master says…scribes. Real Journaliss need not apply…..not even those who fake their own kidnappings. 😉
And your’e left with 80s Thatcher Children
Last night watched last 10 mins or so of new Harry Enfield/Paul Whitehouse vehicle. Very obvious, very poor.
So Enfield left, became unfunny & then returned! (Shame to see PW off form).
Is there any chance of an answer, or are you another output-only device?
g.cooper i’m on your side,it was gloating beeboid i quoted from this post
Gloating Beeboid | 14.04.07 – 11:27
The moral of this story is: the sorts of opinions and worldview that characterize this blog have turned out to be pure commercial poison.
my bit was underneath,
The NJU has voted on Friday to boycott Israeli goods.
1. How many BBC reporters voted for this? And if they voted on this issue, is this compatible with their job?
2. Will the journalists now go back to using pen, paper and landlines, given that most of the technology they use has been invented/built in Israel?
3. Can we find the names of the people who voted for the boycott, and will they declare their vested interest when they write an article about Israel next?
See this article: http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1176152792457&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
GCooper | 14.04.07 – 1:03 pm
No, I’m sure you’re right, it can’t have been the politics that drove the viewers from 18 Doughty street in droves.
It must have been the sport or the entertainment.
And how very odd of you to imagine that when I spoke of your politics in a less than reverential way, that I was criticizing Telegraph-style conservatism!
You must think you’re in the centre. It’s visceral!
Don’t get me wrong – I know just how popular mainstream conservatism is. I’d put a wedge on Cameron to beat Brown.
But no-one would think they’d wondered into a Tory dinner party if they visited this blog. Nor watched Doughty Street. There’s a huge difference between Middle England and the la la land you inhabit.
As for print journalists – ok so they can disguise their true selves between some finely crafted words.
But point the unforgiving eye of a TV camera and the truth will out.
TV outs all fraud and insincerity.
My beat is that after ten seconds of watching Sweaty Dale mugging for his close-up, the audience was off to the pub.
Peregrine – why gloat you ask.
The difference is that my corner shop doesn’t sell boxes labelled ‘Anti-Tesco Bile’.
Doughty Street peddled little else than anti-BBC bile.
Done gloatin’. I’ll be GB from now on.
imli | 14.04.07 – 3:29 pm
did israel really invent the computer?
Anonymous:
imli | 14.04.07 – 3:29 pm
did israel really invent the computer?…
“Why Jews Succeed”
Why does the Arab Middle East so wholeheartedly embrace anti-Semitism? I have always found it peculiar that, while many Arab countries suffer from a pitiful economic, political, and social backwardness, wherein no democracy or prosperity can be found, Arabs discuss their problems only within the context of their hatred of Israel.
But Israel is only a small country that occupies a tiny piece of land in the Middle East. A desert fifty years ago, it has become a thriving and prosperous democracy. How is it that this small nation is the cause of all Arab problems?
In the eyes of many Arabs, success is obviously Israel’s crime.
But here is the key question:
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=234
Ben writes:
“g.cooper i’m on your side,it was gloating beeboid i quoted from”
My apologies, Ben. I misread your post.
GB writes:
“And how very odd of you to imagine that when I spoke of your politics in a less than reverential way, that I was criticizing Telegraph-style conservatism!”
You haven’t a clue about my politics, you presumptious twerp. Well – save that I loathe ZaNuLabour and its cheerleaders at the ‘when we win the election’ BBC.
Clue: I’m not a Tory.
The only thing you’re right about is the unappealing prospect of Iain Dale. Sadly, the rest is nonsense.
Incidentally, Dale’s problem is at least half because he is regarded by many as a Tory wet. And just to prove the point, it appears he’s recently been recruited by the very Telegraph you seem so approving of!
For the most part, 18 Doughty St consisted of half a dozen trendy young metropolitan bloggers chatting amongst themselves about politics and blogging to a potential audience of political junkies numbering, oh, dozens on a good evening.
And you think its failure represents some kind of triumph for the BBC?
What are they putting in the water down at White City, these days?
@Anonymous: Intel stuff is designed there and lots of software (MS, Apple and Open Source) is also written in Israel — often core components that are used everywhere. So, if you want to boycott Israel, it is pen and paper for you, sorry.
GB
Very strange because the 18DSt programmes I have watched (btw not the in-line bloggers on a comfy sofa chatting to themselves that reminds me so much of News 24 and MSM journos slapping each other on the back) have been decent interviews where individuals have been allowed to expand on their topic. With regards to Tim changing focus (see I can do spin speak as well!) if he had looked as if he got a decent nights sleep then perhaps he would be more presentable.
I still think my analogy with small organic shops stands. Many do market themselves as providing something that has been lost with the supremacy of the supermarkets and provide consumers with a choice that is not normally available, e.g. locally sourced meat of a considerably higher standard than the supermarkets are able to offer; however, they also offer some pretty awful stuff that has little right to be in a modern food chain.
Of course the main difference between supermarkets and the BBC is that they take complaints seriously. In the last report on possible anti-Israeli bias by the BBC (unlike many on this blog this is not what infuriates me about the BBC) there was strong condemnation for the way the BBC handles complaints. Rather than take that on board the BBC has smugly sat back and accepted that the report was generally favourable.
As for the commenters on this blog being in la-la land I would have thought a BBC full of arts graduates steeped in post-modernist thinking would see their views as equally valid as those of Guardian columnists. Unless, of course, some views are more equal than others.
Funny that Humphrys doesn’t become incandescent when some man-child signs a contract for, what, £30 million just because he can kick a ball. It’s only people who actually create wealth who annoy Humphrys.
Anonymous:
“did israel really invent the computer?”
Israel, through the Scitex company pioneered digital printing and scanning. Before digital printing photographs were printed onto bromide paper and then taken to a camera operator who photographed the picture through a screen using a large camera. The screen positive was then laid-out by hand to be rephotographed and printing plates made. Been there, done that – worked for a time at SCITEX – worked in newspapers who still used that method.
Imli’s statement that most of the technology they use has been invented/built in Israel is not far from the truth.
I wanted to comment on the NUJ boycott (my information came from the Guardian organ grinder blog) I couldn’t find BBC mention of it.
Does anyone know:
❓ What percentage of BBC people are members?
❓ What percentage (and who) of the NUJ voting delegates are BBC?
❓ What does the boycott mean in real terms i.e. how in theory and practise this should affect BBC publications?
The NUJ boycott of Israel:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1176152792457&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull
I just hope the Israeli government bears it in mind when renewing visas for British journalists.
Presumably the vote was taken at this same meeting yet there’s no mention of it here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6556147.stm
By the way, if 30,000 people have allegedly signed the petition calling for Al AnJohnston to be freed, and if the BBC employs 26,000 journalists, and assuming they all signed, then only 4,000 real people actually give two figs whether he’s freed or not.
Imli’s statement that most of the technology they use has been invented/built in Israel is not far from the truth.
deegee | 14.04.07 – 7:33 pm
See here, right hand column:
http://newsoftheday.com/
And here:
http://www.israel21c.org/
As for “Gloating Beeboid”, he and his fellow BBC employees are parasites on the wealth created by others. The BBC survives because of a compulsory tax on everyone who owns a television set.
Abolish the TV licence fee, and we will find out how many people, given the choice, really want to subsidise the BBC’s sanctimonious leftist propaganda.
Sorry to harp on about this, but the elusive “Rejected comments” tally has now reappeared on the Johnston HYS – and other HYS forums.
DEBATE STATUS
Total comments: 2659
Published comments: 1462
Rejected comments: 636
Moderation queue: 561
So I think we’ll have to give the BBC some credit for inching painfully a little closer to transparency.
But I wonder why the HYS “moderators” chose to publish this vile reply
Added: Friday, 13 April, 2007, 19:13 GMT 20:13 UK
Samuel Cohen of Jaffa: I only pray for safe return of Alan.
JOHN, LOS ANGELES
to this reasonable comment
Added: Friday, 13 April, 2007, 15:09 GMT 16:09 UK
Free Alan and Gilad Shalit.
Samuel Cohen, Jaffa Israel
when they chose to delete the folowing comment of mine only a few hours after posting it on the thread:
Added: Friday, 30 March, 2007, 09:23 GMT
Being kidnapped is not something I would wish on my worst enemy and I hope Alan Johnston is released soon. But if he was going to be seized by Gaza thugs anyway, he should rather have reported objectively on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, thereby providing a real service to the public.
Instead, he has coated the bitter pill of truth about this conflict with so much sugary nonsense about the “plight” of the Palestinians that he has made it seem that they can do no wrong.
I’d like to get access to the rejected comments for this topic – and others. I’ve no doubt that would settle the question of the moderators’ bias once and for all.
You can be GB from now on but I will call you by your real name “Gloating Beeboid” – becuase that describes the BBC to a tee.
“gloat·ed, gloat·ing, gloats
To feel or express great, often malicious, pleasure or self-satisfaction.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/gloating
“Prince William splits from Kate”
World headline news from the BBC – says it all more like the daily Mirror than a “serious” media outlet.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/
Archduke, thanks for that. Also,I agree with you about Any Questions.
“Pickwick | 14.04.07 – 9:27 pm ”
its the “throwing stones” bit thats got me raising a few eyebrows.
http://www.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&ie=UTF-8&ncl=1115275913
are there piles of stones lying around just waiting to be thrown in Scotland?
or indeed, if you walk into any council estate/rough area in the UK, are there piles of stones lying around?
how come we hear about knife attacks but not “stone throwing” attacks?
if you look at scumbag behaviour its generally either a) fisticuffs b) knives c) a bottle or in the worst cases d) a gun.
but “stones”???
By the way, if 30,000 people have allegedly signed the petition calling for Al AnJohnston to be freed, and if the BBC employs 26,000 journalists, and assuming they all signed, then only 4,000 real people actually give two figs whether he’s freed or not.
Biodegradable | 14.04.07 – 7:57 pm
They started the petition with 300 journalists, not all of them BBC and then got 8000 people signed up, then they closed it for some reason and reopened it on 12/04 and got a further 20 000 by the end of the next day.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6518185.stm
With the endless publicity they’ve been pumping out, that’s not a huge number. They even got the UN Secretary General, Ban Ki-Moon, to appeal for Johnston’s release.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6546059.stm
Good to have friends in high places.
“did israel really invent the computer?
Anonymous | 14.04.07 – 4:43 pm ”
Intels main R&D lab is in Haifa.
the chip you are probably using has been produced as a result of Israeli research.
“Doughty Street peddled little else than anti-BBC bile.
Done gloatin’. I’ll be GB from now on.
Gloating Beeboid | 14.04.07 – 4:20 pm ”
you must have been watching something different to me. they interviewed Richard Sambrook, head of the BBC World Service, and it was quite a civilised and interesting interview, where Richard was allowed to put his point of view across.
Doughty was never advertised as a “bash the bbc” outfit. it was more pushed as an alternative to the soundbite style of interview on BBC news or “Today”, allowing an interviewee room to breathe , over the space of a solid hour. a counter-balance to the perceived “dumbing down” of bbc news output. *that* was an interesting concept , that i think people of all political persuasions would welcome.
so, i dont think it was actually competing with the BBC per se – it was just offering something completely different, and indeed, something more intelligent at times. you could dip into Doughty as WELL as doing your newsnight & andrew neil binge.
speaking as a libertarian flat taxer, i never saw Doughty as being the bulwark of anti-statism, but more part of the patrician “one nation” Toryism that i have very little time for.
Microsoft, IBM, Intel, Motorola and Cisco operate primary R&D centers in Israel
In addition the voicemail box on GSM mobile phones (what modern journalist could work without it?) was introduced by Israeli Company, Comverse.
I guess the promoters of the boycott thought they would have to stay away from oranges and chocolates.
why is Prince William splitting from his girlfriend deemed to be bigger news than the gun battle in Basra where Brit troops killed 27 terrorists?
look at the main news page…
http://news.bbc.co.uk/
sorry for Prince William and all that, but for gods sake, can we get a grip?
basra battle report:
http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/british-forces-at-war-as-witnessed-by-an-american.htm
finally tonight (10 o clock news) i see a battle report in basra – a different one to the battle in the link above. 8 terrorists killed.
no losses to us. but that report was after all the “prince william split from his girlfriend wooo ha”
its probably unfair to single out the BBC in this case – the rest of the British MSM will also be all over the Prince William story as well.. and thats just pathetic.
” deegee | 14.04.07 – 10:24 pm”
they also have to boycott about 80 per cent of the worlds websites.
the language they are written in is PHP – which is owned by Zend Technologies – an Israeli company.
so, no internet , besides microsoft.com , for those journalists.
Police in Basra were unable to confirm the eight dead men were from the Mehdi Army, but other local sources claimed they were from the Shia militia, loyal to Moqtada al Sadr.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6555339.stm
BBC fu*kwits!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mehdi_Army
…”created by the Iraqi Shi’ite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr in June 2003″
Anonymous | 14.04.07 – 10:52 pm
try reading that BBC sentence again anonymous – I think you’ll find they know what the Mehdi Army is and the second bit is explaining it…not imaging some other outfit.
…..or an easier way to get it….
re-read the sentence and when you get to the phrase ‘other local sources claimed they WERE from the Shia ……’ imagine the word were in caps.
Personally, I’m with ‘Gloating Beeboid’ – it’s great that Doughty Street are bringing a gay guy on board, instead of being stuck with Iain ‘pussy hunter’ Dale.
See, it’s the BBC’s high-kwality research that makes all the differnece.
Anyway, how right-wing was Doughty Street anyway ? The Yazmonster and Deranged Pete were both regulars anyway. So were plenty of Libs. Even deranged 7/7 truther Rachel North was on there a lot.
Indeed, like a lot of the folks here, my problem with Doughty Street is that it wasn’t ideological enough. It felt like you were bugging a Metropolitan dinner party. They’d have done better to find a Rush Limbaugh figure, someone with some drive, some aggression. That’s not an ideological point either. A show with a committed Leftist would also have made better TV. You just wanted someone who looked like they actually believed in what they were saying.
dumb -> thats exactly what i’m saying.
thats why i pointed out the likes of Hugh Hewitt in the U.S. by way of comparision – i disagree with the guy on a LOT of issues, but by god is he passionate about it. thats why i like listening to him. he’s passionate about what he believes in – BUT, may i add, not disparging about people that have a different viewpoint.
doughty just felt like a “metropolitian dinner party” where everyone agreed with each other. it just didnt make for good TV…