– Dr Who was ace. Perhaps the best ever.
Apart from that, this is an open thread – for comments of general Biased BBC interest:
Please use this thread for off-topic, but preferably BBC related, comments. Please keep comments on other threads to the topic at hand. N.B. this is not an invitation for general off-topic comments – our aim is to maintain order and clarity on the topic-specific threads. This post will remain at or near the top of the blog. Please scroll down to find new topic-specific posts.
Don’t blink.
is it just me , or have we gone back 500 years in this country? if so, what future do my children and their children have?
this are big issues to do with very nature of Britain as a nation itself. fast forward these “honour killings” a further 20 years, and we’ll end up with a “children of men” scenario.
hopefully, i’ll be in America by then.
Ultraviolets | 12.06.07 – 12:09 am:
Re: Michael Rosen. He’s a Marxist nitwit whom MI5 blacklisted and prevented from working for the BBC in 1971, as did MI5 in the case of current Guardian journalists Isabel Hilton in 1976 and Richard Gott in 1981 (the latter of whom The Spectator exposed as a KGB agent in December 1994).
by that i mean the random bombings and terrorism every day. “Fugee” camps in Kent with armed Hezbollah… watch that film. the overlying plot of infertility is a bit of a sop to the real underlying message (i suppose the director had to do that in order to get the funding… but the one scene that stuck in my head was the hezbollah march in the fugee camp – located in Kent…)
” Jonathan Boyd Hunt ”
good god almighty.
and they wonder why young Muslims dont identify with “Britain”.
JBH writes:
“Re: Michael Rosen. He’s a Marxist nitwit whom MI5 blacklisted and prevented from working for the BBC in 1971”
Hardy, Steele, Rosen… fascinating how many from the hard-Left the BBC employs in prominent positions, isn’t it?
Balanced, of course, by such noted BNP members as… um…. and err….
And no, just in case Reith is stirring in his coffin, I do not make a distinction between the SWP and the BNP. Both are statists of the very worst kind.
Ultraviolets:
G Cooper:
I’ve been wading in this cesspool for some time now. It’s amazing how the same shit surfaces all over the place.
I’ve been thinking for some time of changing my moniker on this blog to “Winston Smith.” What do you recon?
JBH writes:
“I’ve been thinking for some time of changing my moniker on this blog to “Winston Smith.” What do you recon?”
On the whole, I’d say posting under your real name gives you a moral edge over cowards like Reith and that troll who (according to TPO) writes for the Gradunia.
“…but the cops ARE to blame. they are supposed to be protecting citizens and keeping the peace”
I do not disagree with that – quite right the police’s role is to protect. I was not questioning that – my point was that while the probing into the police incompetance will take centre stage – the murderer and the “reason” behind it will become lost (to the media)..
BBC BRINGING US A COMFORTING MESSAGE ON “HOME GROWN” ISLAMIC TERRORISM
Ever noticed how any “BBC expose” of home grown Islamic terror ends with a comforting positive spin …. this piece of “investigative journalism” had an underlying message that our decent muslim radicals are in fact on side ….
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6740743.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_6740000/newsid_6742600/6742657.stm?bw=bb&mp=wm
No where near as good as what Al Beeb entertained us with a few years back .. at least that was an uncanny parody of 7/7 ….
disturbing how something that the BBC laughed off came terribly true ….
G Cooper:
Noted. Thanks.
BBC WELTANSCHAUNG IN A NUTSHELL
you have to love Al Beeb’s smart assed cyncism … “superior brits” indeed
Britain’s police have turned into just another whiney, inefficient, political-correctness-ridden branch of the public sector. They’ve become too self-important for the pedestrian work of deterring crime. They prefer racing to crime scenes to walking the beat, despite studies showing the effectiveness of the latter.
Indeed, unlike American police departments that have outsourced paperwork to civilians to free up more cops for the streets,
British forces have outsourced actual policing to civilian ‘community support officers’
http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?menuID=1&subID=1111
I must add that I wouldn’t tar every single officer with the same brush. There are still brave and decent police officers out there – the reason for their ineffectiveness is because they have become politicised thanks to new labour. Ten or 15 years ago things would have been different.
” Jon | 12.06.07 – 12:57 am ”
indeed jon indeed.
and then you wonder why a “diversity officer” gets about 30k a year , whilst you scratch your head at the insanity of it all.
” Jon | 12.06.07 – 1:24 am”
all labour has done to the cops is just done a revenge for the miners strike. but over ten years so nobody would notice.
and we joe pubic have to deal with the consequences for such petty squabbling.
oh joy. the bbc now has a vatican correspondent, full time, in the vatican.
well, thats according to the BBC advert on news 24 i just watched.
last time i checked, england was a protestant country.no wonder the muslims are all confused and dont buy into this “british” thing.
Yes, ‘Jonathan Boyd Hunt’ has a very gentlemanly tone to it. Can’t say the same for a certain shaven headed ‘man of the world’ who trolls here.
I used to read the ‘Lenins Tomb’ blog. Michael Rosen would occasionaly post on that blog, he once wrote (in response to Gilad Atzmon) that the world is controlled by a WASP conspiracy, not Zionist. Hmm.
Of course I have no link to prove this but I do remember it.
But anyway, it’s appalling that once blacklisted imposters and traitors are working for the Guardian. When will the storm come to blow these old leaves away.
British Police : Shackled and ineffectual
Taken from the Lion Heart blog:
I am homeless and have had no alternative but to sleep in a car at different stages, I am completely bankrupt living hand to mouth, I have no bank accounts so cannot work, I can no longer use my I.D because the Pakistani Moslems can trace me and all because I stepped forward to help the police prevent Heroin & Crack being pumped into my community.
I received no money for my actions and money was not discussed, I did not come forward because of money, I came forward because it was the right thing to do and now look at my situation.
I hope Hillhunt reads this and trys to poo-poo it. I wonder if the shaven headed emasculated man of the world, a Guardian pinko 5th columnist, will tell us that Lionheart is either a liar or insane.
I challenge every Policeman, workers within the British intelligence community, Politicians and ever other worker of this generations State controlled paymasters who have children and family to protect in this country to disagree with what I say or with what Fjordman has written. You who enforce your greedy power hungry paymasters will are crippling and breaking this Nation and your children’s futures as well as mine and every other innocent British citizen will pay the price of your actions.
Anyone noticed Shami Charkrabarti out and about on telly/radio today defending this girls ‘human rights’ ie the right not to be murdered in the name of religion (islam)? Or is it just those who allegedly plot to carry out murder in the name of religion (islam) who Liberty deems worthy of campaigning for?
Ritter | 11.06.07 – 10:56 pm | #
Quite.
archduke:
oh joy. the bbc now has a vatican correspondent, full time, in the vatican.
I have no problem with that although I’m surprised that the Rome bureau couldn’t cover it.
BBC World has access to 2,000 journalists, 250 foreign correspondents and more than 50 BBC overseas newsgathering bureaux.
Does anyone have a break-down of where they are stationed? I bet that the harder the gig e.g. Africa, the fewer permanent BBC correspondents.
This morning the R4 news bulletin announced that Alan Johnston “disappeared” in Gaza 13 weeks ago. The superstitious folk at the BBC believe that Gaza is a mysterious place where people “disappear”, where fighting “flares up”, where people are strangely “left dead”. Nobody ever kidnaps, kills or murders. Not unless, of course, it can be pinned on Israel.
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
FBI director predicts terrorists will acquire nukes:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20070611-104521-9295r.htm
.
Today programme
“07:23 The International Committee of the Red Cross says conflict is spreading in Afghanistan and civilians are suffering unbearably We speak to Pierre Kraehenbuehl, the ICRC’s Director of Operations.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/listenagain/
Not yet available to listen to. However, the moral equivalence alluded to in this piece is breathtaking. Thus “Pierre” tells us that combatants on all sides are causing undue hardship to Afghan civilians. Thus our friend “Pierre” brackets together the coalition forces, there under UN mandate, and the Taleban, who use women and children for cover, and who murder women who want to get an education.
As ever, it doesn’t cross Montaquinn’s Beeboid mind that this is a bizarre position for any civilised person to take. You can see the mission creep now – those who have been vehemently opposed to the Iraq invasion are now starting to focus on Afghanistan (it was better under the Taleban etc).
And as if on cue, in the news headlines just after that the reader tells us that US forces in Afghanistan have mistakenly killed 7 Afghan policemen. See? See?
Today programme
So-called “honour killings”.
“08:20 We hear from one of the sisters of Banaz Mahmod, killed by her father and uncle in an “honour killing”, about life in the Iraqi Kurdish community here.”
In this longish piece, two words are completely absent from Naughtie’s patter – these are “murder” and “muslim”. As though treading on eggshells, he tip-toes around the elephant in the room. We even have a policeman on who is so drenched in PC-ness (pun intended) that he also avoids mentioning the elephants, such as the fact that some in the community actually helped the father to cover up the murder. Thus the blame for the murder was shifted from the father to the police, for not responding soon enough (no doubt they felt they had to be “culturally sensitive”). In Beeboid land, such murderers are seen almost as victims themselves.
I am not racist (I often feel the need to say that these days, sad isn’t it?, but we do need intelligent analysis of these murders. Why do they happen? Is it cultural or religious in motivation, or both? Does it happen in non-muslim ME communites? How can the police stop them?
Certainly the BBC’s attitude does little to put a stop to this brutal behaviour.
archduke | 12.06.07 – 12:36 am:
” Jonathan Boyd Hunt ”
good god almighty.
and they wonder why young Muslims dont identify with “Britain”.
Archduke, do you think Ultraviolets would be tempted to do another movie from the images and captions on this slideshow?
GCooper | 12.06.07 – 12:40 am / Jonathan Boyd Hunt 12.06.07 – 12:30 am
…..fascinating how many from the hard-Left the BBC employs in prominent positions, isn’t it?
To the best of my knowledge, Michael Rosen has never been a member of the BBC’s staff, let alone occupied any senior position.
That said, I believe he has been used as a freelance presenter of a children’s poetry programme on Radio 4. A post for which he is well qualified as he is one of Britain’s most successful children’s book writers, perhaps best known for We’re Going on a Bear Hunt, which, despite its title, has nothing to do with any anti-Soviet crackdown.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/search/ref=pd_lpo_ix_dp_go_us_uk_en?keywords=michael%20rosen%20bear%20hunt&tag=lpo%5Fixdpgousuken-21&index=blended
Guardian writer….Isabel Hilton in 1976
Uh oh! A libel. We can’t go over it. We can’t go under it. We’ll have to through it:
It is true that Isabel Hilton was blacklisted. It was later admitted to have been because of a mistake by MI5, who confused the names of two organizations with the name ‘China’ in their titles. One was a Maoist front organization, the other a literary and cultural society which included a BBC governor and a Downing Street staffer in its membership! Hilton had been a member of the latter. She received an apology. Isabel is not and never has been a member of the ‘hard left’. On the contrary, she has been ‘a trenchant critic’ of Chinese communism.
As for Guardian writer….. – that is nowadays true. But it seems a somewhat limited description of someone who started in journalism on the Daily Express, moved on to spend almost a decade on the Sunday Times before joining the Independent at the time of its launch and spending a further nine years there.
I’ve been thinking for some time of changing my moniker on this blog to “Winston Smith.” What do you reckon?
Having led your chum Neil Hamilton to disaster in two libel actions, JBH, I reckon it’s a wise move if you plan to continue playing fast and loose with the truth.
GCooper • actually what is remarkable about the BBC is how few hard-line lefties have been employed. Anyone recruited to the domestic services before October 1985 was subject to MI5 vetting. After that date vetting was restricted to World Service staff.
Though exceptions were sometimes made for talented drama types (e.g. Roland Joffe, Ken Trodd) people with a background in hard-left organizations were barred from News and Current Affairs.
Unlike in Fleet Street • where ex-Trotskyites like Peter Hitchens and Janet Daley were able to find work and prosper. Fortunately, for all of us.
an islamic London would be sooooo much better…
and no. this isnt a joke.
http://www.timeout.com/london/features/2993.html
John Reith:
I merely stated the facts. The facts were correct. If you inferred something I didn’t state that’s your problem.
” Jonathan Boyd Hunt | Homepage | 12.06.07 – 9:48 am”
i hope he does. thats one you linked to is top class stuff! really does join the dots together.
PRESS RELEASE – 11TH JUNE
STOP ISLAMISATION OF EUROPE (SIOE) DEMONSTRATION 11th SEPTEMBER OUTSIDE THE EU PARLIAMENT
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! -NO SHARIA HERE!- DEMOCRACY NOT THEOCRACY!
These are the rallying cries that people all over Europe are shouting far and wide to Islamists both within Europe and in other countries who seek to impose Sharia law upon European citizens.
It is not only to Muslims, who seek to expand Islam across the whole of Europe, that Europeans are saying “Enough” it is also to our politicians who connive with Islamists to establish Sharia law by stealth. From building regulations to burial rights, the majority of Europe’s population is increasingly expected to adhere to Sharia law.
“Hate” laws now make it a crime to speak out against Islam even though it is just another totalitarian political system. Our free speech, which has been gained over many centuries by defeating tyrannical regimes through many bloody wars, is now being removed solely to protect Muslims from being offended. Nobody has the right to not be offended.
SIOE is a Pan-European movement determined to not merely stopping the surreptitious Islamisation of Europe, but reversing it.
The first step in this reversal is a march comprising people, from many European countries, all demanding that all non-Islamic European nations remain non-Islamic and a halt to encroachment of Sharia law.
Anders Gravers (Founder of SIOE Denmark and leader of the political party SIAD) said: “We do not believe in the concept of ‘moderate Muslims’. The evidence points to Islam being the opposite of moderate. The heart of Sunni Islam is Saudi Arabia and the centre of Shia Islam is Iran. No rational person can describe these two countries as ‘moderate’; at least not when compared to European values. We now have children in Danish schools being forced to eat Halal meat so that Muslim pupils are not offended. What next? Are Danish women to be stoned to death for being raped as they are in Iran? Or are people to be beheaded for leaving Islam as they are in Saudi Arabia? No! We will not allow Europe to become a huge Saudi Arabia or Iran”
Dr. Udo Ulfkotte (Founder and president of the non-profit charity “Pax Europa”) said: “We clearly feel the pressure of Islamisation in Germany. German police and courts are more tolerant to Muslims than to non-Muslims. One of the highest German courts (Bundesgerichtshof) has just downgraded the punishment for Islamists who publicly declare and ask for violent Jihad in Europe. Unacceptably, some judges have quoted the Quran and not German law in court cases. Polygamy, once illegal in Germany, is now permitted only for Muslim men, who may even claim state benefits for their wives. German life is changing to appease Muslims. For example, Christian crosses in our public institutions are being removed and there are separate swimming times for Muslims in supposedly public pools (which non-Muslims’ taxes pay for).
German Muslims demand a quota for “positive reports” from the German media, but they kick out the religious group Bahai from an inter-religious conference because they refuse to accept them within the “dialogue”.
All this was once described as hypocrisy, but is now actually promoted by our feeble politicians.
Stephen Gash (Founder of SIOE England) said: “Appeasement of Islamists has become ridiculous. Non-Muslims are expected to be buried facing Mecca and to sit on toilets facing away from Mecca because cemeteries and new homes have to conform to Muslim sensitivities. Toy pigs are banned from offices and Christmas lights must now be called ‘Winter Festival lights’ so as not to offend Muslims. None of these oppressive measures were even contemplated when Jews were the only ones who could possibly be offended by pigs and ‘Merry Christmas’.
Absurdly, to criticise Islam results in accusations of ‘racism’. Well, I’ve always considered racism as being the lowest form of human stupidity, but Islamophobia to be the height of common sense.”
Charlotte Westergaard (SIAD board member) said: “The biggest danger comes from our own politicians who promote Islamic values at the expense of our own values. The way things are going all European non-Muslim citizens will be paying the Jizzya tax to Muslims as they did during the days of the Ottoman Empire. Of course the politicians believe they will be exempt • until the local Imam knocks on their door.”
Anti-totalitarian stance of SIOE – http://sioe.wordpress.com/brusse…ssels-demo- 2007
http://sioe.wordpress.com/ New website under construction
http://siad.wordpress.com/
http://siad.dk/ 15,500 hits per day average
http://akte-islam.de/1.html
Contacts
Anders Gravers
SIAD and SIOE Denmark
Denmark
Tel 0045 9677 1784
00456191 6026
E-mail sioe@siad.dk
Dr. Udo Ulfkotte
Pax Europa e.V.
Germany
Phone 0049 173 329 1840
Fax 0049 721 15151 2200
E-mail udo@ulfkotte.de
Stephen Gash
SIOE England
Tel 0044 1228 547317
E-mail sioe.nsh@btinternet.com
phoebe | Homepage | 12.06.07 – 10:01 am | #
Abandon Ship writes:
“I am not racist (I often feel the need to say that these days, sad isn’t it?, but we do need intelligent analysis of these murders. Why do they happen? Is it cultural or religious in motivation, or both? Does it happen in non-muslim ME communites?”
Race has absolutely nothing to do with this story, though. In fact, the way the BBC is lying about the underlying facts is more likely to stir-up racism than if they told the truth.
According to the BBC, the key factor in this murder, as represented on radio, TV and, today, its ‘news’ website, is that the victim and her family were Kurds.
It isn’t hard to imagine how, in the simple mind of a racist thug, it is their nationality that sticks in the mind. As it does, for example, with ‘Pakis’ – i.e. ‘anyone whose racial origins lie in the sub-continent’.
But the cause of this wicked murder was not the nationality of the participants. It was their insane religious beliefs.
I have posted several times about this story in the past 24 hours because I believe it to be the most perfect recent example of the BBC’s willingness to fawn over Moslems, even to the extent of deliberately misleading its viewers and listeners.
It is because of this sort of wilful mendacity that, reluctantly, I believe the BC should be closed down. It is no longer worthy of the description ‘news’ organisation. It has become a medium for Left-liberal attempts at social engineering. And if the truth gets in the way of that, it stands about as much chance as did poor Banaz Mahmod.
http://www.vigilantfreedom.org/
The BBC, how it covers Honour killings and half a story.
Strange how the BBC leaves out of the story how that poor child Banaz Mahmod had at 20 left an violent husband from an arranged marriage behind. Instead it just promotes the image she fell in love with the wrong man. Err No BBC she left the wrong man behind. She fell in love with the right man.
Any Muslim reading the BBC story will feel justice has been taken in how they promote that story. Shame on you BBC for promoting Murder as a just cause.
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/9549/Guilty:+The+Muslim+father+who+ordered+
John Reith writes:
“GCooper • actually what is remarkable about the BBC is how few hard-line lefties have been employed.”
Amusing diversionary tactics, Reith. Now, perhaps you’d like to address the ceaseless use of the airwaves to expound the political views of Messrs Hardy and Steel (among others)?
Incidentally, you missed Word of Mouth from Rosen’s CV. He may not literally be on your employer’s payroll, but he’s kept pretty damn busy by them – as are so many Lefties.
Also, come to think of it, you seem to have forgotten the Stalin-groupie, Ewan McColl, whose ghastly shade still seems to inspire so many at Broadcasting House.
But if we think the BBC is bad, just look at The Independent, which doesn’t even bother with quotation marks in its headlines:
Honour-killing victim told police four times of fears father would murder her
Still, the Indy mustn’t upset its growing muslim readership.
JBH QC:
I merely stated the facts. The facts were correct. If you inferred something I didn’t state that’s your problem.
This is, in full, what you wrote:
Re: Michael Rosen. He’s a Marxist nitwit whom MI5 blacklisted and prevented from working for the BBC in 1971, as did MI5 in the case of current Guardian journalists Isabel Hilton in 1976 and Richard Gott in 1981 (the latter of whom The Spectator exposed as a KGB agent in December 1994).
JR pointed out what is well known, and can be easily checked, that Isabel Hilton was the victim of mistaken identity.
Given your extensive knowledge of libel actions (albeit on the losing side), you will be aware of the dangers of juxtaposition, in which defamation happens when people are linked to others as if they all have something in common.
Merely stat(ing) the facts is not a defence. As you already know…
So Isabel Hilton is “a trenchant critic’ of Chinese communism”? Does this mean she wants to see them exterminated and/or driven into the sea, as does that “trenchant critic” of Israel, Amadinnerjacket? Is she acquiring nuclear weapons to that end?
BBC: All the Newspeak that’s fit to broadcast.
From Abandon Ship
Thus the blame for the murder was shifted from the father to the police, for not responding soon enough (no doubt they felt they had to be “culturally sensitive”).
Yesterday’s C4 News Snowmail wanted to lay (some) blame at the door of the police, because of the police “family’s”* failure to recruit sufficiently from the community.
But as Abandon says
some in the community actually helped the father to cover up the murder
So would more police recruited from the community improve matters?
(* We used to have a police force, which became a service, but was described yesterday by the Beds Ch Const as the police family)
John Reith | 12.06.07 – 9:50 am:
You say:
Having led your chum Neil Hamilton to disaster in two libel actions, JBH
Wrong on both counts:
1) I used to be friends with Neil and Christine when they lived in Cheshire but we rarely speak now. Indeed, the last time I spoke to either Neil or Christine was at Norris McWhirter’s memorial service, Thursday October 7 2004. Your characterisation of me as a doting Hamilton groupie is well wide of the mark.
2) I had not “led Hamilton to disaster in two libel actions,” as you say. I first came on the scene following the May 1997 general election, as a consequence of Martin Bell’s obviously dishonest, shifty response to my questions in the tap room of the George and Dragon, Great Budworth, Cheshire, a few weeks earlier during the election campaign. I had no input in Hamilton’s libel action of Oct. 1994-Oct. 1996.
The first time Hamilton cited our research in a national public forum examining the affair, was during his address to the Standards Committee in October 1997 – a performance which, against all expectations, resulted in the Committee’s failure to endorse Downey on the central “cash” allegation, as you and your bigoted blind-eyed BBC chums know full well.
With respect to Hamilton’s libel action against Fayed of Nov.-Dec 1999, against all my advice and warnings of what would ensue if The Guardian’s cover-up was not exposed – confusion among the jury as to why Fayed would make false allegations against him – Hamilton took the advice of his legal team and instead opted to fight it on the explain-nothing simple strategy of “Fayed is a liar.” Apparently they feared that the jury would not be able to get their heads around the notion that the entire British media, including the BBC especially, would censor evidence showing that The Guardian had perverted the Downey inquiry if that research had merit.
It was my expressed view that it was an over-simplistic strategy that was destined to fail and it did so.
I noticed at the weekend that the BBC had finally got around to realising that Lewis Hamilton is not black. He is, in fact, mixed race. I presume that it didn’t suit their chosen narrative to stick to the facts, no matter how obvious it was.
JBH QC:
You don’t think your Reds-Under-The-Beds witchunting technique..
He’s a Marxist nitwit whom MI5 blacklisted and prevented from working for the BBC in 1971, as did MI5 etc etc
…sits a little strangely with your enthusiastic collaboration with Living Marxism magazine and your lavish praise for the writer James Heartfield, not long before a leading light in the Revolutionary Communist Party?
here’s something to REALLY annoy the Guardianista types.
george bush getting a rock star welcome in Albania:
HH. I can well see that JBH would be happy for his interpretations to be published anywhere, given the reluctance of the mainstream media to get involved. Equally one can see that LM, given their somewhat limited influence in modern British life, would relish the publicity involved in publishing something ‘controversial’. It’s called pragmatism, a much underrated and increasingly rare virtue in a world of rigidly ideologised ostrich tendencies.
The BBC and how it presents a despot as Misunderstood
Viewpoint: Kaunda on Mugabe
Leaders in the West say Robert Mugabe is a demon, that he has destroyed Zimbabwe and he must be gotten rid of – but this demonising is made by people who may not understand what Robert Gabriel Mugabe and his fellow freedom fighters have gone through, says former Zambian President Kenneth Kaunda.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/6728015.stm
Yup the BBC has no problem defending a truly evil man who has more blood and misery on his hands than Bush ever will. But according to the BBC he is misunderstood. I notice that the BBC didn’t give any Black people who have to live under the jack boot of ‘Bob’ the chance to air their views on this hero of the chattering masses at the BBC.
The BBC and how it presents a despot as Misunderstood
Israel has just successfully launched a spy satellite called Ofek 7. It can transmit high-resolution images of objects as small as 70cm across.
Here’s some humour from the Ofek 7 construction team:
“From now on personnel at Iran’s nuclear facilities should smile when they look at the sky.”
http://www.iba.org.il/
(First item on English TV News – click on right. Link will probably last till tomorrow morning.)
GCooper 12.06.07 – 10:17 am
Abandon Ship asked some perfectly sensible questions about ‘honour killings’:
Why do they happen? Is it cultural or religious in motivation, or both? Does it happen in non-muslim …communites?
Instead of offering any measured consideration, you launch into a rant at the BBC, accusing it of ‘wilful misrepresentation’.
As it happens, the phenomenon of ‘honour killings’ isn’t limited to Muslim communities. As this report from The Hindu demonstrates, similar cases have been noted arising out of inter-caste relationships among Hindus and between different kinds of Sikh.
http://www.hindu.com/2004/01/13/stories/2004011305091200.htm
The story of Fatan Habash shows that, though rare, it is not unknown for Christians to perpetrate ‘honour killings’ in the Middle East.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1512394,00.html
Trying to disentangle ‘culture’ from ‘religion’ is tricky.
What can be said with some certainty is that ‘honour killings’ tend to take place in families that come from socially-backward peasant societies.
While most ‘honour killings’ in Britain are committed by Muslims • that’s because the majority of people who have migrated here from socially-backward peasant societies are Muslim.
No doubt Islamic fundamentalism contributes a large part to perpetuating the practice, but the overwhelming majority of British Muslims would condemn it. To represent it as ‘normal’ among UK Muslims would be wrong.
Quite apart from the ethnic, cultural and doctrinal factors • there’s probably a large psychological/character aspect to it too.
In this recent case, the fact that father seems to have been an egotistical b**stard seems pretty relevant.
One of the things he objected to was his daughter’s use of hair spray • not something the Koran mentions, I’d guess.
From the evidence presented in court, his motives seem to have been mixed: a hatred of ‘Westernized’ behaviour, the fact that his daughter’s suitor was the wrong kind of Kurd (Iranian, from a different clan/village) counted at as much as • perhaps more than – his reported view that the young man was insufficiently devout.
Cockney:
I can well see that JBH would be happy for his interpretations to be published anywhere, given the reluctance of the mainstream media to get involved.
Indeed, although the lack of worthwhile evidence does help to explain the media’s unwillingness to engage.
However, the difficulty with m’learned friend’s approach is his claim…
http://www.haloscan.com/comments/patrickcrozier/7732521461450178885/#358707
…that his cause is the victim of the leftist bigotry that permeates the industry, a claim clearly strained by the enthusiasm of the Living Marxists and their recently ex-Revolutionary Communist writer.
It’s one thing to paint yourself the victim of Lefty bigotry (which plays a treat with the Biased BBC audience), another to co-operate heartily with the far Left when it suits your purpose….
Another entirely to start spraying around Reds-Under-The-Beds smears on top of it all…
There’s pragmatism and then there’s unprincipled obsession…
Police today admitted they needed to “take stock” of the lessons to be learned during the investigation.”
Isn’t this the “stock” response of all public services after they have been caught out in a gross neglect of duty?
talking of media-wide conspiracies:There was a piece on the toppling of Saddam’s statue in Baghdad and it covered the ‘central figure’ (!).This chap took a sledge hammer to the base of the statue and was the focus of press attention (according to the piece).I watched the entire live coverage of the toppling and I saw something much more interesting.A man in his sixties?,wearing a ‘jenna’ hat – one of those white pill-box hats with the central crease.Together with a young boy of maybe 7 or 8.The man attacked the statue’s base with a sledge hammer.He then directed (imo) attempts to climb the statue.After several fruitless minutes,he walked toward a suited,very stern man of western appearance.This ‘westerner’ had his hands on his hips and a face like thunder.I took his attitude to be ‘what the hell are you playing at’!Of course the heavy equipment the Americans had standing by then took over.When the statue was eventually toppled,it’s decapitated head was ridden by the boy with the ‘old man’ in close attendance.I’m sure the ‘westerner’ was CIA/FBI.The ‘central figure’ to me was always the ‘old man’.The (unreported) story was the attempt to choreograph the occasion.If you have a chance to watch the full morning’s coverage of the toppling (perhaps on fast forward!)you’ll see what I mean.It all took place in clear view of the camera but ‘history’ records another as the ‘central figure’.Marvellous really.
Pounce: considering that Kenneth Kaunda was a corrupt and incompetent tyrant who was eventually driven out by his own people, his endorsement has perhaps less than binding value… oh, you mean that the BBC did not mention that small matter?
JR
Points well taken, but why can’t the BBC have the guts/honesty to discuss these issues head on? Perhaps for the same reason that this never made it to the BBC as a film documentary?:
http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?&id=9635
“In the end, the BBC drama was never made. The script was finished in good time, but the commissioners decided it wouldn’t work as a drama. I was also told that the script was “anti-Muslim.” But as we approach the second anniversary of 7/7, Beeston’s story deserves to be told.”