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Oscar write;
Postal strike – what postal strike? – they don’t want to disturb the chorus of approval for Gordo by mentioning industrial unrest. But they do report this:
I never looked at the subject from that point of view. But looking at the BBC business site seems to substantiate your claim seeing as how a Postal Strike will effect nearly every business in the country.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/default.stm
HH:
“Their deeds are, it’s true, considerably less bloody than bin Laden’s, but their wellspring is something nasty, divisive and – ultimately – equally vicious.”
Come on, it’s in the deeds mate, not the words. Any idiot can sit around talking rubbish, but until they actively participate in genocide they’re hardly on a par with A.Q. – just a dangerous twit.
Hillhunt: I have often found it curious that many of those who, on this board, say the BBC believes “The Jews are evil, anybody who defends them are evil” are often the first to defend the BNP, whose leader has a history of making anti-Jewish statements, updated a book abou Holocaust denial, and has indeed be convicted of incitement to racial hatred over comments about Jewish people.
(Please note I’m using Pounce’s phrase as an example of a general attitude; not specifically accusing him of being a BNP fan).
The point is this: even Melanie Phillips despairs at those who see criticism of Israel automatically as criticism of all Jews (and here, I DO make direct reference to Pounce’s quote above – I don’t know how you get from “the Israelis like Tony Blair” to “the BBC thinks all Jews are evil”, it’s one hell of a leap). But criticise the BNP, a party led by a PROVEN HOLOCAUST DENIER, and suddenly you’re being called a galazy of expletives.
Jo | 28.06.07 – 2:25 pm
If you detest one group as much as another, then you hold them in the same light!
Why? You seem to have a very black-and-white view of the world.
I detest Michael Moore. I detest Al Qaeda. I detest Polly Toynbee. There are degrees of detestation, like there are degrees of hate, or love. That seems quite a simple and straightforward intellectual concept to me, but you seem incapable of understanding it, or are deliberately misunderstanding it for effect.
Try reading the original post again and tell me where it says I think the BNP are the same as Al Qaeda. http://www.haloscan.com/comments/patrickcrozier/3289696097036604691/#362731
Or do you live in a world of right and wrong and nothing in between?
Where does it say that?
You seem to be arguing with a straw man, you’ve created, and not with anything I’ve posted.
Idiots like you say you encourage people to make their own minds up but then say the only choice is A or Z (no B,C,D,E,F etc)
Yes, I encourage people to make their own minds. Where do I say — as opposed to you — that the only choice is A or Z — other than in your posts.
You ARE a knob.
You are entitled your opinion.
So in your black and white world you detest these people equally?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sim…i/Simone_Clarke
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama
No. The straw man that you are creating and arguing with believes that. I’ve made my position clear. You choose — for whatever reason — to misunderstand it.
If you do then you are a moron.
Since you have created a straw man, you are, in effect, arguing with yourself. You may therefore want to be careful who you call a moron.
If you don’t then your post was the work of an imbecile.
The original post was quite clear. You choose — for whatever reason — to misunderstand it.
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 2:41 pm | #
So even you can recognise a difference between Simone Clarke and Mark Collett? Yet you still hold them in the same esteem as Al Qaeda!
You quoting some idiot’s anti-semitism when you constantly turn a blind eye to the BBC and it’s anti-semitism is repulsive.
Anybody who makes comparison to an organisation which has murdered 10s of thousands of people with another which has murdered considerably less (i.e. none) is repulsive.
Postal strike – what postal strike? – they don’t want to disturb the chorus of approval for Gordo by mentioning industrial unrest.
pounce | 28.06.07 – 2:30 pm
not exactly shouting this one from the rooftops either…
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/6249300.stm
So Prince Charles has saved the stunning Dumfries House for the nation.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1993673.ece
Funny how al-Beeb has missed it entirely. Instead it goes with the annual cost of monarchy story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6248072.stm which it spins with a republican pressure group.
Can’t help thinking that, as an architecture fan, I’ve had better value out of the Monarchy this year than out of al-BBC. And just think of the buildings we could save with just a tiny fration of al-Beeb’s budget!
Jo:
The BBC is not anti-semitic, and only an idiot could imagine so. Or a Knob.
Jonathan (Cambs):
You’re right about deeds, but the BNP, having previously had a nasty reputation as street-fighters and thugs, have chosen the sound-bite and sharp suit as a way forward for now, believing the ballot box offers hope of power. Even so, they gave birth to a wannabe terrorist group in the shape of Combat 18, who used fire-bombings and other terror tactics against perceived enemies of the white race.
The fact remains that they are serious about power and serious about hiding their true nature. It’s a long way from AQ, agreed, but it well deserves Stuck-Record’s detestation.
Stuck-Record | 28.06.07 – 3:02 pm | #
Why? You seem to have a very black-and-white view of the world.
Hello….anybody there.
Most people have varying degrees of love, hate, detestation. Except you. You seem to detest a load of completely different groups as much as each other. Therefore you have no in between. It’s A or Z, right or wrong, black or white.
Can I make myself any clearer?
You say
I detest the BNP as much as I detest Hamas, Al Qaeda, the Ku Klux Klan, the Socialist workers party, Respect etc
It’s there. You said it. I live in a world where I can detest Al Qaeda more than the SWP. You obviously don’t.
So, who do you detest more?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simone_Clarke
or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama
It’s usually the liberal lefties on here that start talking about straw men when they can’t answer a question.
If the answer was clear to me I wouldn’t be asking, I have better things to do. And please, no reference to strawmen, one word is fine
“Simone”,
“Osama” or
“both”.
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 3:11 pm | #
You’re right about deeds, but the BNP, having previously had a nasty reputation as street-fighters and thugs
What, all of them? Grow up.
You want to go out on a less affluent parts of my neck of the woods, Middleborough on a Friday night. Then you’d see thugs. And guess what, they all vote Labour.
Should I draw comparisons between Brown, Blair, Darling, Hain et al to Al Qaeda now?
Thought not.
Jo:
The correct answer is Simon Cowell.
Now find something worthwhile pursuing.
Jo: Are you a troll sent to make B-BBC look idiotic?
“Anybody who makes comparison to organisation which has murdered 10s of thousands of people with another which has murdered considerably less (i.e. none) is repulsive”, you say.
I assume here that al-Qaida is the murderous organisation, and the BNP the one which has “murdered considerably less.”
So is it alright if a group is just a bit racist, then? They’re both led by anti-Semites, after all.
Jo: You mention Hain up there. A man who took on and stood up against Apartheid South Africa.
And yet you’re standing up for a party led by a man convicted for racial incitement.
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 3:25 pm | #
Jo: Are you a troll sent to make B-BBC look idiotic?
I think a few people here manage that themselves especially when they have the same view point as hillhunt.
I assume here that al-Qaida is the murderous organisation, and the BNP the one which has “murdered considerably less.”
Well done. Did you lift that from Jeremy Hardy’s ‘Compendium of things slightly funny’.
I’m pointing out that Al Qaeda are a bunch of murdering bstards and holding them in the same regard as BNP, SWP, Respect is rather stupid and makes this site look stupid.
I’d probably say all members of Al Qaeda are murdering, evil thugs. If you can’t relate that to or understand what I mean about Simone Clarke and the BNP then yes, I suppose I have made some aspects of this site look stupid.
Thom:
“So is it alright if a group is just a bit racist, then? They’re both led by anti-Semites, after all.”
Of course it’s not alright. To quote Pulp Fiction, it’s “pretty f’in far from OK”. But surely you have to allow for dgrees of non-OKness, for want of a better non-loaded term.
I know people that hate Americans in general and think 9/11 was a good thing. That makes them racists. But they’re not the same level as Al Qaida because they haven’t perpetrated genocide. And no, they’re not as bad as the BNP because they haven’t put forward a political agenda based on their bigotry and ignorance, and tried to make it UK government policy. The day the BNP kill 1000s of people, I’ll think of them in the same temrs as A.Q.
Not that that’s impossible……
I assume here that al-Qaida is the murderous organisation, and the BNP the one which has “murdered considerably less.”
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 3:25 pm
you mean you had to think about it ?
Hillhunt: I have often found it curious that many of those who, on this board, say the BBC believes “The Jews are evil,
Thom Boston |
zionists not jews…
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 3:29 pm | #
Jo: You mention Hain up there. A man who took on and stood up against Apartheid South Africa.
But hasn’t he been in trouble with the law, on several occasions. Does that make him a thug?
And yet you’re standing up for a party led by a man convicted for racial incitement.
When was that then? Just because I can detest Al Qaeda more than the BNP, doesn’t make me a supporter.
I detest Blair more than I do Brown, so far, but I’d quite happily send both to the Tower.
I think somebody said something about straw men. I’m not quite sure what it means but can I use it now?
Callmedave: The reason I had to clarify which group Jo meant was because the way he/she had written it above – “…quoting some idiot’s anti-semitism when you constantly turn a blind eye to the BBC and it’s anti-semitism is repulsive.
Anybody who makes comparison to an organisation which has murdered 10s of thousands of people with another which has murdered considerably less (i.e. none) is repulsive.” – reads as if you he/she was accusing the BBC of murdering people.
And no, not Zionists, Jews – that’s the wording Pounce used. Have a look.
Bloke in burqa blasted
The BBC wasn’t ‘obliged’ to run this story and hasn’t but I thought that a male Hindu wearing a burqa so as not to be mobbed by his fans and asking the blessing of a Muslim
saint on his film Aap Kaa Surroor (Your Intoxication) was worth a raised eyebrow.
BTW he was only verbally blasted. No singers were hurt in the production of this weird story. 🙂
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 3:29 pm | #
Sorry, as much as I tried, I couldn’t let this go
You mention Hain up there. A man who took on and stood up against Apartheid South Africa.
Are you really under the illusion that Peter Hain brought down apartheid?
And when you say stood up against, do you mean terrorist activities?
If so then I assume you think terrorism is ok in certain circumstances. I see now why you think Al Qaeda are on a par with the BNP etc.
Are you a follower of Islam by any chance?
BBC 10pm news last night. Worth saving if anyone can. An example of the bias at its most obvious. All they did was praise Brown and rubbish Cameron.
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 4:08 pm | #
reads as if you he/she was accusing the BBC of murdering people.
Maybe on planet Thom.
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 3:11 pm | #
You’re right about deeds, but the BNP, having previously had a nasty reputation as street-fighters and thugs
hillhunts always telling us not to demonize the majority of a certain religion (no argument’s from me on that score)for the sins of the few,but the comment above does make you seem a tad hypocritical hillhunt.
because as jo says
What, all of them?
Jo: So many straw men you’ve got a little army.
“Are you really under the illusion tnat Peter Hain brought down apartheid”?
You quote what I said, and then infer something else altogether, and in the process look completely ridiculous. I said “a man who took on and stood up against”. I did not use the words “brought down.” I could say, oh I don’t know, a Man U fan stood up against the Glazers. It’s not the same as saying they brought them down, is it?
A pathetic line of argument, utterly pathetic.
And I don’t see why my personal religious beliefs should have anything to do with it. I don’t like the way that you suggest I have terrorist sympathies and then immediately inquire as to whether I’m a Muslim, it smacks of “all-Muslims-are-terrorists” to me – but perhaps it’s just clumsy wording on your part. Or perhaps you do think all Muslims are terrorists. (Or will reply with the retort, “no, but all terrorists are Muslims”. Which is patent nonsense).
callmedave:
hillhunts always telling us not to demonize the majority of a certain religion
When did the BNP become a religion?
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 4:23 pm | #
You quote what I said, and then infer something else altogether…pathetic
You still haven’t provided a link to where I stood up for the BNP. Or did you infer that?
it smacks of “all-Muslims-are-terrorists”
Oh dear, inferring again are we? I made tha point because to the best of my knowledge all members of Al Qaeda are followers of Islam. (I don’t know if your train of thought goes back more than a sentence or two but Al Qaeda has been the brunt of my posts).
I love it when stupid people can’t see their own hypocrisy.
Hillhunt: I have often found it curious that many of those who, on this board, say the BBC believes “The Jews are evil,
Thom Boston |
And no, not Zionists, Jews – that’s the wording Pounce used. Have a look.
since when is one person a many…
How the Daily Mail now panders to the Left:
Daily Mail: “Brown could be a Great PM if he learns to work with his enemies”
The difference in the Daily Express:
“It`s good riddance to the Blair era, but what can we expect from the man who stole our pensions? Gord Help Us Now”..
“Gordon Brown has promoted a phalanx of young supporters to the Cabinet, most of whom have never had a proper job in their lives.”
http://www.express.co.uk/blogs/post/156/blog/2007/06/28/11608/Meet%20the%20new%20Home%20Secretary…I%20just%20wish%20I%20never%20had
.
Let’s put this in context.
Combat 18 and the Animal Liberation Front are two sides of the same coin-rather like the Red Front and SA.
SWP and BNP are also both sit on the same sides of the fence, with all that sloganeering about “class war” and “identity politics”.
Both are quite happy to get into bed in all manner of “causes”, both have an unquenchable thirst for violence and ‘direct action’. Both are linked with dogma that was better buried under Russian snow circa 1941-45.Both impose suffering and misery; both are misguided,deluded and authoritarian.
Both have big gobs with no balls, and are quite happy to support tyrants of any description (look at the names behind Stop the War).
Oh…….both blame everything on the ‘Jews’…ooooooopps “Zionists”
BTW- Peter “Golden Brown” Hein and co spent more time making sure Mugarbe (the father of Africa back then) got his AK47’s than “fighting apartheid”…..
Back to the UB40 CD’s and dream on.
When did the BNP become a religion?
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 4:24 pm
dear me thats a bit desperate.
callmedave: “Since when is one person a many.” Fair enough, so you think the BBC thinks Zionists are evil, not Jewish people.
A quick search of the word “Zionists” on the BBC site reveals a total of one story from this year. 4 from last year. One from the year before that. And two (count ’em) from the year before that.
So perhaps you could show me all the pages where the BBC specifically says Zionists are evil?
So perhaps you could show me all the pages where the BBC specifically says Zionists are evil?
its next to one that says all students are smelly.
callmedave:
Members of the BNP have bought into a political philosophy which bases its appeal on fear and hatred of other races and religions. Its creed was once openly and has since become covertly Nazi. Its political appeal is based almost exclusively on the demonising of other races and religions.
Not so with Muslims, the overwhelming majority of whom are committed, peaceably, to a faith they believe to be the word of God.
‘THE FREE WORLD HEARS YOU’
JOINING BATTLE VS. MIDEAST EXTREMISM
By GEORGE W. BUSH
June 28, 2007 — Excerpts from President Bush’s remarks yesterday at the rededication ceremony for the Islamic Center of Washington.
“So today, in this place of free worship, in the heart of a free nation, we say to those who yearn for freedom from Damascus to Tehran: You are not bound forever by your misery. You plead in silence no longer. The free world hears you. You are not alone. America offers you its hand in friendship”.
Two Pages
http://www.nypost.com/seven/06282007/postopinion/opedcolumnists/the_free_world_hears_you_opedcolumnists_george_w__bush.htm
Radio Times has Piers Morgan listed as a panelist on tonight’s “Questiontime”.
He’s rarely off the TV.
As editor of the Mirror he printed bogus photographs which increased the dangers faced by our troops.
No problem.
If he had printed the Mo cartoons he would never have worked again.
Hillhunt
You’ve excelled yourself. That is the most bigotted, immature piece of bullsh1t I’ve ever read
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 4:44 pm |
your right,everyone connected to the BNP is evil and wicked,happy now..
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 4:23 pm | #
Come on Thom. Don’t give up on me.
Please supply a link to where I stand up for the BNP.
Or admit you committed the heinous crime of ‘inferring’.
…pathetic…
Jo
I think we are just going to have to agree to differ.
It has obviously enraged you that I consider the BNP, SWP and Al Qaeda as equally deserving of my detestation. The fact that Al Qaeda, and Islamic-fascism, is currently the greatest threat to the civilised world is, in my opinion, without doubt.
It is also, in my opinion, without doubt, that the fascists of the BNP (heirs to the throne of Hitler), and the totalitarian communists of the SWP (heirs to the thrones of Stalin and Pol Pot) have caused, in the past untold misery and millions of deaths. The fact that these revolting organisations are not currently in the ascendant is neither here nor there. They would very much like to be, and anyone who makes light of them, gives them breathing space to grow.
I don’t confuse their present abilities with their ambitions and intentions. They mean to destroy all that I consider to be precious: Western Enlightenment.
I’ve made my position clear; repeatedly, so I’m going to bow out of this debate now.
callmedave:
Happy? So happy I’ve buttered my baby’s grits.
Just a thought: What does any of this whither-the-BNP have to do with BBC bias?
Jo: Hillhunt can of course defend himself, but I would suggest there’s no part of his statement that can be described as “bigoted, immature bullsh1t.”
The BNP does base is appeal on fear and hatred of other races and religions. We know this. Nick Griffin has a public order conviction for racial incitement. It used to have a policy of compulsory repatriation for ethnic minorities. It now says those minorities who do not wish to “voluntarily” repatriate can stay as “guests.” This is a policy that is about emphasising difference and with that difference, fear.
Its creed was once openly and has since become covertly Nazi. We know this too. Griffin has addressed the German National Democratic Party, for example – a party that denies the Holocaust. Griffin, as I mentioned earlier, has updated a book denying the Holocaust. The BNP has also accepted money from the German neo-Nazi group Blood And Honour.
Its political appeal is based almost exclusively on the deonising of other races and religions: also demonstably true. Read the damn party’s constitutuon, which declares the BNP “is wholly opposed to any form of racial integration between British and non-European peoples.” The demonising of religions – how about Griffin’s description of the Holocaust as “the sorry tale of the Hoax of the Twentieth Century.”
Stuck-Record | 28.06.07 – 5:10 pm | #
I must apologise for being offensive. I do find Al Qaeda to be the utmost scum and was slightly enraged.
I’m ok now though.
Just a thought: What does any of this whither-the-BNP have to do with BBC bias?
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 5:12 pm |
how should i know,
you’ll have to ask jo and stuck record,i was just amused by your hypocrisy.
Breathless sycophancy from Montaquinn On R4’s PM, as I type. She’s standing among the press pack in Downing St, yelping truly penetrating questions at Broon’s acolytes as they saunter by (“How do you feel at being in the cabinet, Mr X?”) and receiving not a word in reply (though one of them did nod at her, which clearly made her day).
It’s more like the head girl of St Trinian’s covering the runners and riders at Aintree than a serious piece of political reporting.
£3 billion, was the figure we’re charged for this amateurish, partisan nonsense, wasn’t it?
Thom Boston | 28.06.07 – 5:16 pm | #
As I said before, my beef is with Al Qaeda, I don’t give a toss about the BNP.
Can I have the link now where I stand up for the BNP? Or do the manly thing and admit you inferred.
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 5:12 pm |
Nothing probably. But I think your views are indicative of many who work at the BBC i.e. “some groups bad”, “terrorists sometimes good”.
Whereas I’d say, ‘terrorists always bad’
Thom Boston:
Jo: Hillhunt can of course defend himself, but I would suggest there’s no part of his statement that can be described as “bigoted, immature bullsh1t.”
How about this?
Its [the BNP’s] political appeal is based almost exclusively on the demonising of other races and religions.
Not so with Muslims, the overwhelming majority of whom are committed, peaceably, to a faith they believe to be the word of God.
hillhunt | 28.06.07 – 4:44 pm
It had me in stitches.
http://www.prophetmohammed.co.uk/
Biodegradable | 28.06.07 – 5:30 pm
hillhunt.rose tinted spectacles,and a handful of grits
The BNP has also accepted money from the German neo-Nazi group Blood And Honour
And the Communist Party of Great Britain accepted money from Stalin.
The above discussion reminds me of the Life of Brian and the spat between the Judean Peoples Front & the Popular Front for Judea.
There ain’t much difference between National Socialism and Communism.
Who needs extremists when you have socialism.
The alliance shudders
Melanie Phillips: “So is Britain’s new Prime Minister Gordon Brown going to defend the free world or surrender it to its enemies?
Will he cut through all the dissimulation and manipulation by jihadis and their western useful idiots and instead call the threat to the free world by its proper name? Will he ignore the ever-increasing defeatism and pressure for appeasement, or will he genuflect to the prevalent anti-Americanism and go along with the moral and intellectual inversion that supports genocidal aggressors and blames their victims? As the dust still settles today over the shape of his government, the signs are mixed and not a little alarming.
More
http://www.melaniephillips.com/diary/?p=1567
Perhaps a clue to answering Ms Philips questions as listed by Ian Infidel is the appointment of Malloch Brown to the Brown cabinet.