I very rarely watch BBC Breakfast TV but I have just been told about a gem that was on it this morning just after 8am. It appears we were treated to a short potted history of Gaza and the conclusion was that Hamas, after all, is democratically elected and all that Hamas really want to do is get on with building up the Gazan economy and making life better for the people of that area. The faux analogy with Northern Ireland was then employed with the suggestion that Israel should talk to the more “moderate” wing of Hamas, just like the British Government had engaged with the “moderate” Sinn Fein wing of the IRA. It’s all so risible, so totally detached from reality, that it is almost beyond comment but the reality is that many millions of people will have tuned in and been exposed to this pro-Hamas propaganda. And THAT is the danger of the BBC; it is a willing propagandist tool for terrorism, in this instance shilling for Hamas, the IRA — and for that, it deserves to be damned.
Moving on to other matters Gazan, I see the BBC is relentlessly quoting “500 deaths” without any effort to tell us how many of those killed are Hamas terrorists and how many other were killed because of Hamas. Just one big bite-sized media friendly number, natch. I also noted that on the Today programme this morning, the BBC explained that because of Israel’s refusal to let journalists into the conflict area, it had to rely on images provided by those residing in Gaza. (And they didn’t mean the IDF) It stopped short, however, of making it clear that all images and data provided to the BBC are Hamas approved – so no possibility of any bias there then!
I saw a BBC interview with what looked like a Swedish or maybe Danish doctor at the main hospital in Gaza.
The doctor said that around 40% of the dead or injured were civilians. I was surprised to hear the BBC interviewer challenge this with something like “but the UN are saying only 25% are civilian”.
The doctor replied that the UN had got it wrong. 25% were women and children. 40% were civilian.
And , of course, the “death toll” is a Hamas figure, not independently verified.
Hamas are in total control of the Palistinian propaganda from Gaza and the BBC swallow it hook , line and sinker, without a trace of sceptism or objectivity.
The BBC, as usual, is a total disgrace.
ravi 9:20
And I wonder what would happen to the Swedish/Danish doctor if he didn’t toe the Hamas line ?
Excuse me for my ignorance David: are you suggesting that the comparison is ridiculous for some reason I can’t figure out, or are you suggesting that there are no moderates in Hamas? If the latter, then have you any evidence of this?
BBC Website today:
Main stories
Humanitarian crisis deepens (pro Hamas)
In pictures: Casualties mount (pro Hamas)
Bowen diary: Deluge of envoys (pro Hamas)
Who is a civilian? (pro Hamas)
Eyewitness: Taking cover (pro Hamas)
Gaza City at dawn (pro Hamas)
They sure are working hard for Hamas.
Pallywood is in full swing. I have seen the same woman being taken into a hospital on two seperate occasions in the last 5 days. Unfortunately i’m not technically savvy enough to capture the pictures from my TV.
I’m sorry to say (since I am a supporter) that Israel is losing the propaganda battle. They have obviously been provoked beyond endurance by Hamas & they are entitled to defend themselves, but no-one seems to stop to ask the question: “does this help or harm Hamas?”
Given that Hamas sits behind women & children to maximise civilian casualties I have to wonder if Israel is simply doing what they want.
It’s not enough to be right.
DV: It appears we were treated to a short potted history of Gaza and the conclusion was that Hamas, after all, is democratically elected and all that Hamas really want to do is get on with building up the Gazan economy and making life better for the people of that area.
Sounds like Alastair Crooke was on the BBC yet again, then.
Pallywood is in full swing. I have seen the same woman being taken into a hospital on two seperate occasions in the last 5 days. Unfortunately i’m not technically savvy enough to capture the pictures from my TV.
glj | 06.01.09 – 9:36 am
I’ve just spotted something on Getty Images. The same girl photographed from different angles –
“Palestinian medics carry a killed girl into Al-Shifa hospital in Gaza City on January 5, 2009″
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/84172196/AFP
“GAZA CITY, GAZA – JANUARY 05: A wounded Palestinian girl from the E’lawa family arrives at the Al-Shifa hospital on January 5, 2009 in Gaza City, Gaza.”
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/84174192/Getty-Images-News
In the first photo it looks like the girl’s eyes are closed but the second image shows they are open and looking downwards.
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 9:33 am
are you suggesting that there are no moderates in Hamas? If the latter, then have you any evidence of this?
How many moderates would you expect to find in the BNP?
Have you read the Hamas charter?
From the outset, the whole point of Hamas was to be uncompromising and rejectionist.
It IS enough to be right. We were right when we fought alone against the Nazis and Israel is right to fight against their spiritual heirs in Hamas.
Aas Tom says, being a moderate Hamas member is oxymoronic. IP. No such thing as a good terrorist, unless you work for the BBC,
It is enough to be right but that deos not mean that being right is enough to succeed.
In today’s world success goes to those who can spin the story better whether it be in Gaza or in Westminster.
The BBC is now a very powerful propaganda tool, it’s bias may be obvious to some but unfortunately it is not obvious to all and that is very, very dangerous.
I wonder if the BBC will pick up on this story about Egypt preventing doctors from reaching Gaza
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2009/01/06/news/ML-Egypt-Gaza-Border-Bottleneck.php
Anybody catch this Yonotan Shapira guy, he’s been on BBC 24 twice in the last 2 days, his message must be one that they really want to get across. Won’t be surprised to see him get a prime time slot.
Just now on News 24 they had some one-time IDF officer now-turned-peace-activist on for a nine minute interview – far longer than most interviews they give, to somebody whose view is not exactly representative… But of course, allows them to say they’re balanced, and listening to Israelis, while still towing the party line.
Arthur.
Agreed, that’s why I wonder if we could have even fought WW2 with the BBC in it’s present scale of influence. As you say, very very dangerous.
Do you think that Hammas is capable of staging a massacre of Gazans to generate more anti Israeli hatred in the west?
Now that there are Isreali troups on the ground, a host of eurodhimmis arriving on the scene and hammas has been seriously weakened, is that not possible?
the success of all the previous frauds readily accepted by western journalists in their partisanship and eagerness for any news depicting Israeli atrocities certainly points that way.
The pallywood productions at netzarim junction including france 2 al durah “scoop”, Hebron and the fabrications in Lebanon show that this is gold for the Hammas terrorists and their western little helpers.
Would the BBC willingly cooperate in such dishonesty?
If this is reported by the Burqua Beloved Corporation, it’ll be in a triumphant tone:
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23612225-details/Synagogue+set+alight+during+rise+in+anti-Semitic+attacks+in+London/article.do
That’s why, it is important to go to this link to support Israel:
(4th poll down in list. This is important and not trivial as it indicates real support for Israel in the capital)
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/poll/poll-32758-details/ques-32729-id/Standard+poll%3A+Boris%27s+promise/poll.do
The doctor featured in the BBC clip making the claims of millions dead etc is Dr Mads Gilbert. He is a Norwegian doctor. He is also a political activist of the Rodt party – a Revolutionary Socialist party in Norway. He has aligned himself with the Palestinian cause and is, therefore, the ideal BBC talking head.
He, of course, is entirely unbiased in his version of events. Sarc. off.
If anyone has more time than me and can translate Norwegian better than me, they will probably find out a lot more about Dr Gilbert from a simple visit to Wikipedia and links.
glj | 06.01.09 – 10:21 am
here’s why:
I was growing up in a family in military bases. My father was a squadron commander in the Yom Kippur War in 1973. And my dream was to be a pilot. So, for me it was obvious that I will achieve this dream and I will also contribute to the security of my country.
I learned about the beautiful values, about democracy, peace, justice, equality, freedom, and it took me many years to figure out and to know that at the same time that I was sitting in the classroom in school, learning all those beautiful values, my country, my military, was occupying and oppressing millions of Palestinians, millions of people that were living without all those beautiful values. We have so-called democracy for Jewish people or for Palestinians who are living within the 1967 border. But if you live in the Occupied Territories, it’s completely apartheid.
the commander of the Air Force and the government decided to assassinate the leader of the Hamas in Gaza Strip, Salah Shahade. And they ordered a F-16 with a one-ton bomb, that shot—that dropped this bomb on the house of the Hamas leader in Gaza Strip, killing with him 14 innocent civilians, 14 innocent people, including nine babies. And although I didn’t drop this bomb and I didn’t shoot in my life anyone, but I felt that this, me being part of this system that is causing this harm and this suffering and this killing to innocent people, it’s just the same like being a terrorist in another organization. And those kids who were killed by my fellow pilots and these kids that were killed by this Palestinian fighter are just the same.
http://www.democracynow.org/2006/7/24/combatants_for_peace_former_israeli_and
I heard on French radio news this morning that Hamas is fighting from tunnels that they have dug under one of the main Gaza hospitals!
By failing to point out that when Hamas uses civilians as human shields, it and not Israel is responsible for their deaths and that to deliberately put civilian lives in danger is a war crime amounts to complicity with Hamas’ tactics.
Perhaps the ICC at the Hague will issue sealed warrants against BBC reporters.
5050 noline | 06.01.09 – 10:36 am
Dr Mads Gilbert on Iranian propaganda TV:
Doctor Mads Gilbert is a member of a Norwegian triage medical team present in the besieged Gaza Strip. The team has exposed that Israel has used depleted uranium weapons in its war on the impoverished territory which is home to 1.5 million Palestinians. He described the conditions inside Gaza in an exclusive Press TV interview.
Press TV: What can you tell about the uranium findings?
Dr. Mads Gilbert:The findings about the uranium I cannot tell you much about, but I can tell you that we have clear evidence that the Israelis are using a new type of very high explosive weapons which are called Dense Inert Metal Explosive (DIME) and are made out of a tungsten alloy.
These weapons have an enormous power to explode.
The power of the explosion dissipates very quickly and the strength does not travel long, maybe 10 meters, but those humans who are hit by this explosion, this pressure wave are cut in pieces.
This was first used in Lebanon in 2006, it was used here in Gaza in 2006 and the injuries that we see in Shifa [Hospital] now, many many of them I suspect and we all suspect are the effect of DIME weapons used by the Israelis.
On the long term, these weapons will have a cancer effect on those who survive. They will develop cancer we suspect. There has been very little research on this but some research has been among other places in the United States, which show that these weapons have a high tendency to develop cancer. So they kill and those who survive risk having cancer.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=80685§ionid=3510302
Thanks for the info Anon 10:47. I followed up on DIME. Sounds like a weapon with a limited kill radius, but high lethality within that zone. Probably avoids excessive collateral damage in a populated area, provided targetting is suitably selective/accurate. Sounds ideal for use against smaller terrorist targets using civilians as cover, as in Gaza.
But it is not using depleted uranium, although long term after effects on those exposed may be significant.
Davo,
In a word? Yes.
Anonymous | 06.01.09 – 10:37 am | #
Yes, did a little research myself and found him labelled as a “refusnik” (as in someone who refuses to fight), I expect that the BBC are scouring Gaza as we speak so as to bring us a 10 minute interview with a Hamas refusnik.
“…..that dropped this bomb on the house of the Hamas leader in Gaza Strip, killing with him 14 innocent civilians, 14 innocent people, including nine babies.”
Does the hamas leadership surround itself with baby-shields or do ‘palestinians just breed faster than rabbits? If the former, is this implying that hamas believes the Israelis to have higher moral standards than hamas?
Re S. Weetabix/Mr Vance
It isn’t enough to be right. You have to tell everyone you’re right and, having told them, tell them again and again. And then tell them you told them, and remind them frequently.
The propaganda war matters as always, but especially against an enemy like the BBC, who have no other tools in the toolbox.
I’m not sure if there’s a recent precedent where a modern, Western democracy opts to evict overtly hostile media from a combat zone or, better, a whole country. There have been mild, temporary taps on the knuckles, but that’s all.
Time, way past time, for direct action against the BBC by Israel. And make it hurt.
5050 noline | 06.01.09 – 11:03 am
a weapon with a limited kill radius, but high lethality within that zone. Probably avoids excessive collateral damage in a populated area
…but that won’t stop the BBC calling it ‘the cancer bomb’.
How many moderates would you expect to find in the BNP?
Tom | 06.01.09 – 10:01 am | #
Why not visit the BNP’s website to find out? If the BNP is the ‘nazi’ and anti-jewish rabble which you believe it to be, then you’ll have answered your own question. BUT if you’re wrong…..?
Tom/David: No, I haven’t read the charter, have you a link? I think people often said the same things about Sinn Fein, but ultimately it was negotiation and not invading Ireland (again) that brought about peace.
Knacker,
Yip, I agree with you. It is the scourge of our age that a biased media undermines the very freedoms that allow it to operate. It is the scourge of the UK that we are forced to fund it via the license tax.
For the BBC, the HAMAS it refuses to see:
“In the face of evil, a sudden silence descends” (Melanie Phillips):
[Extract]
“So now Hamas says openly it will murder as many Jewish children as possible around the world”:
[‘Extract from ‘Times’]:
“As fighting intensified on the northern outskirts of Gaza City today, a top Hamas leader broke cover to warn Israel that the Islamists would kill Jewish children anywhere in the world in revenge for their own young who have died in the devastating assault. ‘They have legitimised the murder of their own children by killing the children of Palestine,’ said Mahmoud Zahar, in a televised broadcast recorded at a secret location. ‘They have legitimised the killing of their people all over the world by killing our people.’”
Melanie Phillips continues:
“These are people who deliberately kill their own children by turning them into human bombs — and now they pretend to outrage because, having placed their children in harm’s way in a theatre of war they have created, some of these children have unfortunately been killed. The fact is that Hamas have always specifically targeted Israeli and Jewish children and young people for murder • in accordance with their charter which declares their intention to kill every Jew in the world.”
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/3208771/in-the-face-of-evil-a-sudden-silence-descends.thtml
It’s not enough to be right.
But it’s enough to save the lives of Israeli civilians.
are you suggesting that there are no moderates in Hamas?
Name one.
If the latter, then have you any evidence of this?
See above.
..ultimately it was negotiation and not invading Ireland (again) that brought about peace.
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 11:49 am | #
Perhaps that might have been different had the government of Ireland been lobbing rockets at the UK.
beebnus24 at the moment is rotating regev for about 10 seconds [good] then some twat in a field waffling on about the “humanitarium catastrophe”
“theres fighting in khan yunis now – even more innocent blood”
erm how the fuck does he know?? He’s 2 miles away !!!
now he’s saying both sides are fighting “to capture key areas”
No they are not – Israel is kicking the fuck out of Hamas,and Hamas is hiding down toilets,with women sitting on them.
2 way now to Jerusalem -the friendly fire incident will “harden hearts”???
Now saying that Israel is reluctant to go into Gaza city???? They are in it.
oh i love this……..
update
562 dead and 2700 wounded.
none of it accountable.
who is dead?
Im expecting 1 hamas fighter and the rest of them being civilians,aid workers.
oh god now its perston.
isnt he strange?
It isn’t enough to be right, because ultimately Israel cannot survive alone. The long term gameplan from our peace-loving Muslim brothers is to isolate Israel and cut off support. Marching into Gaza in this way assists that aim.
5050 10:36
And Mads Gilbert’s home town of Tromso is twinned with, guess where, Gaza City !
Now , why don’t the BBC tell us all this ?
Surely, they are not biased ?
Ultimately, it does not matter to Israel what the BBC says.
If Israel succeeds in completely removing the cancer that is Hamas, job done.
No matter what the luvvies in Hampstead and champagne comrades in Islington think or say.
They are totally irrelevant.
How many moderates would you expect to find in the BNP?
Tom | 06.01.09 – 10:01 am | #
I don’t think you can compare the BNP with Hamas, which country do they want to wipe off the map?
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 11:49 am
Here are the key bits of Hamas’s charter.
Not much wriggle room here for milquetoast moderates, I’m afraid:
There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors.
The Prophet, Allah bless him and grant him salvation, has said:
“The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.
The Islamic Resistance Movement is a distinguished Palestinian movement, whose allegiance is to Allah, and whose way of life is Islam. It strives to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine
Leaving the circle of struggle with Zionism is high treason, and cursed be he who does that. “for whoso shall turn his back unto them on that day, unless he turneth aside to fight, or retreateth to another party of the faithful, shall draw on himself the indignation of Allah, and his abode shall be hell; an ill journey shall it be thither.
Marching into Gaza in this way assists that aim
Sure. And allowing the Islamo-Nazis to murder Israelis at will is the way to peace.
are you suggesting that there are no moderates in Hamas? If the latter, then have you any evidence of this?
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 9:33 am
Forget the BNP comparison. A better equivalence is to ask if there were (are) any such thing as a moderate Nazi.
Tom/David: No, I haven’t read the charter, have you a link?
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 11:49 am
LINK
Tom: That’s pretty awesome stuff. I still feel sorry for the 35% of people who didn’t elect them, and those that did but realise their mistake. I’m still not sure Israel is approaching the situation correctly either. I can’t help but feel that such a radical movement will only benefit from being hurt in this way. Do I have to take sides :P? Both are rather difficult to support.
Biodegradable: Well, there were moderate Nazis, and traitors who supplied us with information, and those who didn’t think the final solution was a good idea. This might not be the case in Hamas, I don’t think any of us know.
I suspect the BBC’s risible sugestion about dealing with the moderate wing of Hamas is just a symptom of their need to ‘analyse’. They are proud of their analysis even though it is usually amateur, biased and untested by the need to sell it to willing, informed customers. I suppose it’s good enough for the BBC fans who regard Eastenders, Casualty and dancing competitons as quality product.
This might not be the case in Hamas, I don’t think any of us know.
ipreferred | 06.01.09 – 1:55 pm
Quite. Nobody knows, not even the BBC. So why introduce this straw man into the equation if not as an attempt to legitimise an illegitimate terrorist organisation?
What evidence is there that there are moderates within Hamas?
Is a ceasefire that would enable Hamas to destroy Israel in five years time rather than right now an example of “moderation”?
It’s not a total faux analogy with NI, you are wanting to punish people because of who they vote for, that is not a sensible stand to take…..
just watching news 24 at work and noticed the beeboid cowards wearing body armour while they’re no where near the front
i think they are wearing it for effect rather than saftey. theyre not wearing a helmet, when the head is most at risk from explosions rather than rounds comming at them.