OK, I didn’t see it or hear it but the BBC has been making much if David Starkey’s comments on Newsnight (and 5live?). Did you catch these? Opinions?
STARKEYGATE
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Apparently for BBC-NUJ it is shocking, or even inadmissable for (white) Prof David Starkie to criticise ‘black gangsta culture’, BUT it is alright for (black) BBC presenter, Garth Crooks to do so (2004):
“Gangsta culture a deadly virus, says top [BBC] TV presenter”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/sep/12/schools.society
“Thugs on Parade.”
“Why do white liberals accept the ‘gangsta’ persona as a perfectly legitimate expression of black culture?”
-by American Matt Rosenberg (2005) who concludes about the American political scene:
“White liberals remain particularly close-lipped about the popularity of the gangsta persona. The memories of slavery, lynching, and segregation linger so persistently in the American liberal psyche that criticism of any aspect of underclass behavior remains difficult, if not impossible, for them today. When it comes to the social pathologies of different-colored Americans, a liberal party line prevails: white racism, not black failure, is to blame. The same approach applies when it comes to the racial ‘achievement gap’ in public education, where blacks and Latinos badly lag Asians and whites. White liberals like Jonathan Kozol twist themselves into knots trying to offload onto society—and taxpayers—the entire responsibility for the academic struggles of minority children.
“In precisely this way, the modern-day rubrics of tolerance and diversity become a distancing, and enforced, ignorance.”
http://www.city-journal.org/html/eon_11_10_05mr.html
VERY OFF TOPIC.
Tried to post this last night, but for some reason couldn’t. Anyway had you heard about Calamity Clegg and his tendancy to torch greenhouses..?
Here you go, near the end of interview. From BBC Radio Nottingham apparently…
The mans a buffoon, and I don’t have much time for Clegg either!
Look, you have got to understand what drives people to set fire to greenhouses. The causes are deep rooted – usually in John Innes potting compost No. 3.
The unrestricted mass importation of cacti and other succulents has put a serious strain on our natural tolerance of overseas-grown horticulture. There are over 100,000 strains of Cactii in the third world, and they are taking the place of our own home grown vegetation.
Burning down those greenhouses was a wake-up call. Gruesome but necessary.
Starkey breached the walls of BBC control over this issue last night by letting a white English man comment on the real root cause of these issues. The bizarre nature of Maitlis apparently gobsmacked by Starkey claiming these riots were due to black culture seems a little undermined by Newsnight last Monday, which asked a panel of 3 black men about the cause of the riots. Of course the narrative then was poor blacks, govt cuts, stop and search, evil tories etc. The BBC only does race when the black man can be portrayed as the victim, preferably of a tory. The shock of blacks actually being to blame and accepting responsibilty amongst themselves seemed likely to send Emily into a fit, she had a face like thunder when the item ended.
I posted this on the Open Thread. Please forgive me for copying to this thread.
“Times” 2007
Here something for the less formal, less respectful, edgy BBC. It’s out there.
”
A social worker responsible for two teenage members of a gang that robbed and terrorised commuters on the London Underground was dragged from court yesterday after a dramatic tirade about gang culture.
Liz Johnson appeared to have become overwhelmed by the spiralling gang violence among black teenagers in London. She clambered over two rows of desks at Middlesex Guildhall Crown Court and jumped into the witness box feet from Judge Henry Blacksell. She then leant over and screamed at him: “I’m a social worker. I’ve just lost my job.”
Ms Johnson was in court to see the sentencing of two of her clients who were part of the gang that rampaged through Tube carriages, robbing at least 36 passengers. Two members of the gang have already been convicted of the murder of the lawyer Tom ap Rhys Pryce.
Her outburst started with an apparent reference to the murder of Kodjo Yenga, 16, in West London, last week.
“That boy that was lying on the floor dying. . . they stabbed him to death. Do you know just what they were shouting? ‘Kill him, kill him’,” she said.
About ten court officials and lawyers surrounded her and tried to calm her, but she shouted even louder. “For every black child who is shot dead in their bed by gangs. . . you will f****** listen to me,” she said. “You will have to f****** kill me to get me off this stand.” The judge said calmly: “I have heard you.” When Ms Johnson – who is white – was heckled by relatives of the robbers, she screamed: “They are angry because children are being killed in their f****** beds.”
As she was finally removed from the court, she screamed at the people standing at the back of the court: “Stand up for every f****** black kid that’s got shot . . . for every kid jailed in America.” As she was dragged past black spectators in the public gallery, thought to be relatives of the defendants, she yelled at them: “You bastards – you’ve let your f****** black people down.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article1539707.ece
Or how about this from 2009:
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23635919-half-of-london-teenagers-afraid-of-attack-by-gangs.do
Or this from 2010:
http://www.metro.co.uk/news/828977-black-mafia-gang-members-found-guilty-of-knife-attack-after-youtube-rap
One could go on and on.
It does not offend the majority of black people to say so. This behaviour hurts them. Damages them and their children. It is not black. It is criminalilty based around a phoney black identity. A sub-culture of violence that hides behind the prudery of political correctness. It flourishes because it is not named and shamed.
Gangsta ‘culture’ should be castigated & mocked at every opportunity, while the British Police Force takes apart the hardcore drug gangs that have been destroying peoples lives for over 30 years. Not only my sentiment, but that of black people I know well, who, God knows, have been at the sharp end of these despicable thugs’ behaviour for far too long. They want them gone. And, as for the multiculturalist purblind fools, yes, those beeboids who thought Jay Z was ‘amazing’ at Glasto, I suggest you take a closer listen to his ‘kill whitey’ lyrics. Why don’t you do a feature on the Today programme, Mr Editor?
‘Telegraph’ blog:
“Was David Starkey being racist on Newsnight last night?”
(by Toby Young)
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tobyyoung/100100845/was-david-starkey-being-racist-on-newsnight-last-night/
Toby’s blog has attracted a number of comments so far. Unfortunately it would appear the DAILY MAIL still shows ZERO comments at 1.55pm seems odd to me. Thank god for this site! Now the first point of call for the sane.
spread the word
the more people we can get on here the better
I think that the Mail comments facility has become a total waste of space lately, it seems to be unavailable for most of the time. If it carries on like this I might have to turn to The Guardian “Comments Are Moderated If They Are Not Lefty Enough” >:o
ROBERT BROWN; You can try the guardian if you like David, i survived for about a year before my comment right was suspended, too many pops at Toynbee and Monbiot for their liking, nothing abusive, just straight talking, they cannot take constructive argument for long.
Toby Young is forensic in clarifying and clearing up the lapses in what Prof Starkey said last night. Starkey deserves a Knighthood for being a white man prepared to say what desperately needs saying and basically no white man with a public profile has been prepared to say till now.
Yes I got a few minutes of it!
Once Starkey mentioned Enoch Powell that was it.
The reflexes of the cringing white kid who wrote on chavs, and those of the token cornrow braided balck woman were a sight to behold…with Maitlis skewering herself at every twist and turn of their corkscrew ride into banality and inaninty.
This being the BBC-and Newsnight-on a Friday Night before the Edinburgh luvvies took over-well this was an outrage!
Starkey juts hits their corns…give him a liberated baseball bat and let him keep going.
Just honest is our David-and sees the historical context of it all-exactly what the soundbite squitters of the liberal elite hate,fear and despise…and which is why we need to make foie gras of them at the moment!
Remember ” We don`t need no education”?…apparently they don`t want anyone to get one…but we DO need one…so God Bless My Favourite Atheist!…beanies off to the Stark…no wh`am sayin` bigstyle bruv?
My favourite bit?…when he read out what that “Olympic Ambassador” texted as she looted…seemed the cornrow braided blimp took affence to that!…she`s an English teacher I`d say-and thought it worth a PhD no doubt!
They DO need an education-but Dr Starkey?…what would he know when our Chav chum( SWP-Owen?..who cares?) and Bacon/Brand have given them a hidden curriculum that we`ve now all seen a bit of?
“David Starkey tries to talk about the English Riots on Newsnight “
(11 min video)
If Starkey is wrong and the rioting is not all about gangsta blacks then why are the beeb interviewing so many blacks?
My point exactly, if you look at the majority of BBC guests on all their networks since the riots kicked off, if you take out the usual camp lefty liberals the vast majority are black. Why?
The reaction to Starkey’s comments go to prove that truth is no longer a form of defence as far as the lunatic-left are concerned.
On Newsnight earlier in the week, a black Tory candidate (can’t remember name) said similar things about whites immitating blacks, this was OK. When C4 Dispatches revealed that 93% of gang rapes are committed by blacks, there was a black social worker on there, who worked with both black and white kids, he stated that black males had an entirely different opinion of females than the white kids.
This fabricated ‘Jafaican’ accent, referring to the police as ‘Feds’ etc. prove that British black kids are copying the American gang culture and white kids are copying them.
There ARE cultural and racial issues at play here and the black community are suffering the most because of it.
Labour’s indoctrination system means that they leave school with a huge sense of entitlement and anger about events that occurred hundreds of years ago.
Britain needs more black spokesmen who aren’t afraid to speak the truth, as opposed to jumping on the ‘oppressed minority’, apologist band-wagon (which often pays so well).
Colin Powell and Condalisa Rice didn’t get where they are by sitting around sulking, blaming whitey for all their ills.
Britain needs people such as Col. Allen West, Rev. James Manning etc.
Yes I posted in another thread that a black man had said exactly the same thing on Newsnight and nothing was said.
Yes, just saw it, we’re referring to the same man.
He did the press-preview on Sky earlier in the week. A great speaker and very honest. More people like him are required in this country, but sadly it doesn’t pay so well as screaming “Racist”, “stop and search”, “slavery”, “British Empire”, “Stephen Lawrence” etc. etc. etc.
Wow – I’ve just watched that video and I’m going to have to have a lie down now. I feel like i’ve been verbally beaten around the room and I’m white. =-O 😀
Great post MS!
David Starkey is the first person to address the growing problem of gang culture and its spread throughout our society. It is a “black gangsta” problem and the wanna be “wiggas” that follow it. We have laughed at Ali G but failed to see the serious side of the message he was putting out as to how pathetic it was. Tim Westwood is a great DJ and role model BUT does he really do any one any favours with his “getting down wiv da kids” speak?
David Starkey will be hung out to dry for this by our left wing/biased broadcasters and may never work again because of it ,but to completely ignore what he said as raciest ramblings is wrong. He has pointed out a huge part of the problem, now please lets have someone brave enough to admit it and do something about it.
Whenever James Naughtie pronounces world as “wurrald” on the BBC radio 4 Today programme, I often think of all those white English youth today who imitate Jamaican patois and pronounce like as “lack”.
It was a quite hilarious display of three old colonels spluttering out their port when some young upstart dared to broach a taboo subject in a direct, honest and apparently perceptive manner. Sort of in reverse. Whippersnapper Starkey dared claim that ‘black culture’ particularly in the form of language has a detrimental effect on education and was quickly pushed into the Racist Corner using straw-man arguments (if arguments they could be called) by three cretins in the throes of an unseemly attack of the vapours. A blank refusal to face or even consider – the facts, typical of the sort of thing churned out systematically by the BBC. Three against one in the argument, as well.
I could almost put up with the whole BBC collapsing with a fit of the vapours over Starkey’s comments, except that in almost any other context these guys are desperate to tell us how ‘edgy’ they are and how much they like pushing boundries.
Hell, if Starkey had just dropped his trousers and called for the age of consent to be abolished, they’d probably have signed him up for his own show right then and there.
Good comments these!
Starkey is either Gilbert or George..just the sort of effete fey, ascetic gay bloke of a certain age that the Beeb usually con`t get enough of. Edgy, controversial etc…when he mocked the Queens intellect…why, the BBC were delighted.
After his stint on Jamie Olivers “school”, Starkey had already been proved correct in all his analyses of the feral scum he was expected to work with-and the good, the bright and those ready for the intellectual scraps got much from him…not that that would survive the trip to the JobCentre a few weeks after!
So-Ilike the idea of these “weekend rebels” spluttering into their port just because an old white man with a brain and some historical basis for what he`s saying…only educates them a bit!
Oh they hated that-and so he is 100% correct!
BBC rule of thumb…everything that the BBC want you to believe is wrong. If Starkey is so denigrated-he`ll know that he is right!
Bless the good Doctor, our Mel and Peter Hitchens…and the other heroes of the hour!
It never fails to surprise me when in north London I overhear young white people speaking with that pseudo ‘carribean’ voice – and they cannot switch it off when speaking to the general population in shops etc, even the carpet fitter I had couldn’t speak English that I could easily understand.
Will they still speak like it when they are 50? Hearing the woman on Newsnight saying she uses rap to good effect when teaching English really gets to part of the problem.
Education pushed by the left has to be enjoyable. Why not start early in a child’s education to say ‘OK – you may not like having to learn your tables – but it is something you just have to do’, etc etc. Education is dumbed down to make it ‘accessible’ and education and young people are impoverished by it. A child who appreciates language through Shakespeare will have been challenged more but will get a greater sense of worth by doing it.
sorry – rant over
Deborah, a retired English teacher of my acquaintance was told by a leftie colleague that it was pointless teaching youngsters Shakespeare, ‘They’re not going to need it.’ Just the sort of comment you would expect from a cultural Marxist, classist creep, an all-too-willing dumber-down, who shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near children. My acquaintance had a small measure of revenge when she overheard some pupils re-enacting the 3 witches around the cauldron sequence from Macbeth – not in gangbanger drivel either.
I bet said leftie colleague had the benefit of the kind of decent education that they deem unnecessary for others, no doubt delivered with a sneering, superior contempt.
The hypocrisy of those Lefties ranting against the “materialism” of the looters.
It is possible that Maitlis, for example, works for free (because she is a “public service broadcaster”) and not for the several hundred thousands a year – a million a year in the case of Jeremy Paxman) that is reported.
It is possible that that she goes shopping for clothes in Primark, refuses to buy a flat screen television, and home is a plastic bag somewhere in Romford, and so (and those grounds) she feels entitled to condemn as “greed” any aspiration for a higher quality of life.
She is certainly not going to let a little thing like the fact that she describes herself as a freelance business not a BBC employee to save herself having to pay the new 50 per cent income tax rate stop her from attacking the greed of those who want to reduce tax rates for EVERYBODY.
It is in accordance withe the Leftist handbook – one rule for them another rule for yourself.
Embossed on the front of the handbook on gold letters is “You deserve it”
This EMILY MAITLIS?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-509894/Lady-red-Emily-Maitliss-plunging-neckline-heats-awards-night.html
Dog, mutton, dinner, lamb and oh dear come to mind.
you have an amazing knack of cutting through the BS Martin!!
The woman is vanity personified.
ROBERT BROWN; A textbook taking apart of Maitliss, thank you, appreciated.
David was spot on last night.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14513517
He made some salient points which struck a chord with me. I grew up on a massive NW london sink estate. I myself was guilty of talking patois until the age of 16/17 as i had not yet developed my own character & personality to mthe point where I had the confidence to no longer be a sheep following the herd.
There was a callousness in both expression & intent with the youth in certain concentrated areas. These kids would rather hurt someone for money to buy marijuana/crack than get up in the morning to go and earn it.
The top of their list of aspirations was to be a crack dealer as a few i knew did so for 5/10 years and if they managed to stay alive & out of jail, they would invest in property and beauty salons for their girlfriends.
Not much has changed in the last 25 years. 1 major thing that has is that they they now operate without fear. Whilst growing up the police retreated from the streets and the estates, allowing them to operate with impunity.
Ive seen all races get caught up in this barstardised culture. When they talk in this twisted patois, you wouldnt know what colour the person talking to you is unless you could see their face. What remorse or compassion they may posessed gets turned around 180 degrees to the point where the less you show, the ‘bigger’ you are. You earn more respect when you display extreme cruelty and lack of humanity. I know many lovely older 1st/2nd generation jamaicans who cant believe what has happened and are mortified.
Blend the above with hip hop culture which has slowly morphed from fun & knowledge through to gang & gun culture through to extreme commercialsation & selfishness at any cost. Then blend again with a nannying, socialist state which strips away parental, educational & law enforcement authority and hand these kids all the rights & a sense of victimhood. You end up with a perfect storm of a society that politicians that live in ivory towers and cant even start to understand, let alone remedy & a generation that will make life hell for those who live around them and eventually, themselves.
Paolo365. An excellent post.
The place i grew up.
This film was shot not longer after its build was completed in the early 70’s. Before it all went to shit. I had a wonderful life there til around 11.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14513517 the trouble is he started off placing blame with chav, black “gangsta” and gangsta rap culture culture but was railroaded into discussing black culture without appearing to realise it.
There is no one type of black culture just like there is no one type of white culture.
It wasn’t extensively black Rasterfari culture at the heart of this, they were probably all sat around shooting the breeze, smoking fat ones and listening to Bob Marley.
It wasn’t traditional West Indian culture at the center as they were sat around the table after going to church while the matriarchal feeds them rice and peas and harshly chastising the kids the moment they put a food out of place.
It was the white chav and the much romantisised black gangster culture at the heart of the riots and that was essentially what David Starkey set out to say at the begining (or at least that is how it appeared to me). Unfortunately he was mauled by 3 opponents into sounding like he was blaming an entire race in order to force him onto fight from a position of weakness.
One of the problems that exists here is that there is a vocal section within black culture as a whole, self professed spokesmen and women of the community with very big mouths who would sooner circle the wagons, than place blame on a small section of their culture for fear of that section reflecting badly on their culture as a whole.
As soon as the gun fight starts the liberal media ambush their attackers from high in the mountains with their Winchester rifles so the wagon train can continue with good, bad and all completely intact with the good at the front, willingly oblivious or being made to feel obliged to remain oblivious to the small few who trail behind at the back causing problems.
Yeehaw.
Brilliant post Scoobywho, hit the nail on the head perfectly.
All true sir!
Yet isn`t it funny that Owen Jones(author of “Chavs”) can sidle up alongside some braided black woman( more rap in the classroom ought to do it)-both of these liberal chroniclers of the age saw no problems last Friday night did they?
Starkey was just the excuse to vent their hatred at the whole liberal project-their cartoon caricatures of white and black-all going belly up. Their grants, advances and school workshops all shown to be the useless irrelevancies that they always were-but now shown up as such!
For poor Maitlis to have to think on her Jimmy Chhos was all too much…another profitess of the toxic landfill bequeathed us by her darling friends up and down New Labour and every tentacle round what remains of our “culcha”.
Luckily with Maitlis, Dimblebys, Bacons etc-the Harmans, Prescotts and Williamses(Shirley/Rowan) no longer even have to PRETEND to have to think anymore…for these Beeb ciphers filter the slurry for them in advance.
Not long left for them all though now…
You need only have watched “The History of Hip Hop” that was also on last night (Channel 4) to get the sense of entitlement, self-importance and self righteous slang, that basically boiled down to” F*** the squares and the uniforms”…drugs birds and guns with your boxers on view and slouching into their own hells-with compliant” bitches” on a leash and your other hand on the groin…oh so rad!
Not that I could either hear or understand it that clearly…but hey, I`m a suit in a square that needs to be rubbed-innit blud?
Just listen to Westwood-vicars son to the fake gangsta that personnifies the elites cringe before the bling…
Garth Crooks, black BBC football pundit and ex player. 2004. Hat Tip to “George R” on the ever vigilant Biased BBC blog
“Gangsta culture a deadly virus, says top [BBC] TV presenter”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2…
So – whitey say this, liberals squeal “racism”. Black guy says it – no comment.
The truth can never ever ever be racist.
It’s quite interesting to see the lefty liberals do what they always do when cornered, point the finger and shout “racist”
It’s as predictable as a dog and a lamp post.
It’s also stopped working.
“a generation that will make life hell for those who live around them”
The architects who go on the BBC saying how great the concrete modernistic estates are return, once filming finishes, to their Georgian vicarages in the country.
A Leftist is somebody who (almost by definition) does not give a **** about the poor. A socialist State keeps everybody poor (and therefore powerless) except the Leftist elite, who keep their clients dependent with money looted from those who try to better themselves.
The thought of making money through honest toil appalls them. Listen to the snobbery in the description of Thatcher as a grocer’s daughter. How dare shopkeepers seek to better themselves.
A Guardian reader is an instinctive thief, they just steal via the State instead of smashing shop windows, but the motives (including the hate and envy) are the same.
They blame God for making them such hate filled *****, but there is no cure for hate filled ***** no matter how much they pay their therapists.
Senior Citizens have all the sense, I learned that from watching this movie….
When I first saw this yeeeears back I thought it was just the usual Michael winner-like Hollywood tosh. Suddenly,now, it all begins to make sense…
Biased BBC refers to “Death Wish 3” as a relevent piece of social commentary…
Keep up the good work! You couldn’t make this blog sound more ludicrous if you tried 🙂
I think the irony was that big chunks of this movie were filmed in London
dez doesn’t do irony
just stupidity
ROBERT BROWN; Yes it would have ben nice to see 80+ year olds digging out those dusty Bren guns, MG42’s and Thompsons from attics and giving them an ‘airing’.
If you think liberal elites in the UK (sorry England) are going to admit their mistakes, take responsibility for the state of the nation and adopt new policies you are mistaken. They are narcissistic and ill-informed. But their day is over and history has proved them wrong. To watch a Roy Hattersley or Harriet Harman spout on about the problems of Britain (sorry England) is to witness dinosaurs before the ice age. Their views have been held by the BBC for forty years. It is part of the fabric of the old England (got it right that time). What happens next is anyone’s guess. Does Cameron have the answer? To me he’s the bland leading the blind. All I can say is God Bless – um – England.
And as usual Mark Steyn says it better, funnier and more bravely:
“This is the logical dead end of the Nanny State. When William Beveridge laid out his blueprint for the British welfare regime in 1942, his goal was the “abolition of want” to be accomplished by “co-operation between the State and the individual.” In attempting to insulate the citizenry from life’s vicissitudes, Sir William succeeded beyond his wildest dreams. As I write in my book: “Want has been all but abolished. Today, fewer and fewer Britons want to work, want to marry, want to raise children, want to lead a life of any purpose or dignity.” The United Kingdom has the highest drug use in Europe, the highest incidence of sexually transmitted disease, the highest number of single mothers, the highest abortion rate. Marriage is all but defunct, except for William and Kate, fellow toffs, upscale gays, and Muslims.”
How I would love to see Mark Steyn on the BBC facing up to one of their “edgy” comedians and lefty presenters. He’d wipe the floor….
Quote “It’s quite interesting to see the lefty liberals do what they always do when cornered, point the finger and shout “racist” “
Martin – Liberals don’t get cornered these days, they have learned their lessons from the past. They fight from a position of strength with the media on their side and are ready to attack as soon as anyone sticks their head above the parrapet. They attack mob handed – 3 to one, it was obvious which side was going to come off looking worse. Starkey has started off attacking criminal gangster culture and ended up being made to appear to blame the entire black population for the riots.
Cameron gets attacked for his leadership a lot but he made a very careful choice of words when he apportioned the blame here, he blamed criminal culture and left it to the rest of us to realise what type of criminal culture it was. His voters know it was the combined white chav and black gangster culture without having to be told and the liberal left who’d never vote for him choose not to know anyway.
Brendan O’Neill “Never mind the looters, what about the ‘fascists’”
http://www.spiked-online.com/index.php/site/article/10979/
SUPERB piece of writing (once again) from Brendan O’Neill
Thanks
if you haven’t seen this video-watch it
it says it all
http://vodpod.com/watch/1756476-chris-rock-niggers-vs-black-people
itwf1964, thank you for the clip. On this occassion, Chris Rock is more eloquent than David Starkey.
ROBERT BROWN; This is a revelation, i laughed my head off, funny guy, with a serious message. Tie down leading leftie apologists and force them to watch this, could be amusing, probably all sit there with Jack Dee expressions!
Interesting article – I heard Chantell will let you finger her for a bottle of White Lightning or 10 Lambert and Butler.
Until the Tories wake up and address the real Elephant in the room (the BBC) nothing will change.
What network do the liberals all run to when under fire? the BBC
What network does their dirty work of smearing their opponents? the BBC
What network is a parasite on the public purse? the BBC
Never mind, the BBC are also responsible for such comedy gems as “I use Rap to teach English” and “Where is your empirical evidence that Gangster rap glorifies violence?”
You’ve just rung a bell with me when you mention that comedy gem of using rap to teach English: I’m sure the Beeboid Corporation gave that weird Jafaican street-speak to one of its children’s programmes or characters. I can’t remember which one.
“rastamouse”
’nuff said 😉
‘Nuff indeed. Well remembered, Itwf.
Haven’t had time to read all the comments, sorry:
David Starkey did phrase his comments in a slightly inflammatory way – he focused on one type of “Black Culture”, and I guess he could have said Gang culture or referred to HipHop music without saying Black. He was trying to provoke debate, I guess.
He also was saying something that we don’t face up to. Young boys in this country apparently don’t see someone like Richard Branson as a role model, or Stephen Hawking or Andrew Wiles. Many seem to look to this gang/drugs/fighting culture as the only way of being a man. This culture celebrates the criminal. It is negative, violent, anti-education, anti-authority, and anti-British.
Starkey was interrupted at every sentence he tried to say. The interviewer didn’t like what he was saying and didn’t give him a chance to speak. Both the other interviewees seemed to be there to give different shades of views the Guardian might find acceptable.
(expanded version of this comment is posted on my blog)
Standard tactic used during Andrew Gilligan’s recent session – Studio interviewer ask question, black female socialist gives her view, Gilligan waits patiently for his turn, speaks and is immediately interrupted by black female socialist. Trys again, immediately interrupted again by mouthy BFS. Studio interviewer smiles benignly as Gilligan can’t get a sentence out.
The BFS needs a good slap but no-one will give her one. Result, Gilligan shouted down because he’s too polite to tell the BFS to STFU. Fail Interviewer.
At a meeting between the police & local people in my London borough, a very experienced, tough-minded Chief Inspector said, ‘The problem with these gang members is that they do not know how to be a man.’ Their notion of manhood is utterly warped. Day after day I see these swaggering knumbskulls barrelling through the streets. They may have the physical stature of adult males, but mentally, many of them are infantile retards.They really are aliens, & I don’t mean that in any racist way. They are alien to the majority of human beings, & should be treated as such. The only solution is for the Police Force to ruthlessly dismember every gang & bust them for every single offence committed. A few weeks ago, up the road from me at Gospel Oak, a 200 strong Met police operation with dogs & heavies in riot gear surrounded a park/sports centre that had been taken over by Somali thugs. Every exit was sealed & 22 utter scumbags were nicked. When their homes were raided, the coppers found Aladdins’ caves of stolen property, drugs, credit cards, weapons etc. This was a brilliantly-executed op., based on covert surveillance. We now need the Criminal Justice System to be hardened-up to such a degree that these strutting destructors are resoundingly put down – for good, as far as most people are concerned. Without these poisonous cretins around, the very air is sweeter.
This isn’t the thread to talk about school discipline/selective immigration/outsourcing prison sentences abroad (Poland?) etc, but all these policies need to start working in tandem – now. This last week could, at last, be the turning point. Outside the hallucinogenic wafflings of the wankers that flap around Beeboid-Guardianista, we, the people they despise, are livid, incan-bloody-descent. And if the sight of a few hundred white hard nuts down Eltham away upsets their lily-livered sensibilities then I can assure those of the ‘nuanced opinions’ that there are millions more of us who have had a gutful of being experimented on. Game over.
Anyone else find it odd that the BBC haven’t questioned the Police or Ambulance service as to WHY the man who was attacked in Ealing was left for nearly an hour?
Why was no ambulance brought to the scene? Perhaps the BBC should be asking the Police as to WHY they failed yet again?
You can bet if the man who had died was called Mohammad the BBC WOULD be asking questions.
Perhaps it’s the ambulance service who I keep hearing won’t go into these areas unless protected, fine in which case why were ambulances not protected? Perhaps if he’d received medical treatment earlier he may have lived?
Perhaps the army should be deployed with medics and their own protection to get to these areas.
Perhaps the BBC should be asking these questions rather than running around calling everyone a racist.
I didn’t know that he had been left for that length of time. That was such a tragedy and a cruel fate for a defenceless lone man set upon by a gang of thugs.
Wrong kind of victim for the BBC, wrong colour, wrong class, wrong age. Just a decent elederly white man trying his best in his own little patch of England trying to make things better and he died doing it.
To the BBC he aint a victim he is to blame, he represents everything the BBC hates and despises, decency, bravery, courage, independence, dignity. and to top it all off he is white, that unforgivable crime. How many more will die due to the poisonous influence of the rancid BBC?
As I have posted before, a lot of the lack of immediate direct response by the emergency services is the beaurocratic command and control structure
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_%E2%80%93_silver_%E2%80%93_bronze_command_structure
Though established with good intent from historical situations, it seems to cloud who is able to do what immediately. Ensuring Emergency Services are not put in harms way seems to take priority over rescuing the poor victim.
It was police Gold Command that instructed the police to stand back and not intervene on the first day of the riots. Teflon Cameron breezes in to tell them they got it wrong, but the Command were only doing what they thought their political masters would have wanted.
The army have armoured vehicles that can be used as ambulances, it’s really a joke that badly injured people can’t get treatment because ambulance crews can’t be protected.
If the police don’t want to do it, then stand aside and let the forces deal with it.
I’ve had Radio 3 on for the usual Saturday evening jazz programme and the Prom has come on but not as we think of a Prom. While reading above comment about the poor man who died in Ealing, suddenly I hear this rapper wittering in stupid-speak over the airwaves. I knew they were doing something which they call a comedy Prom, which I didn’t really think much about, but on hearing the rapper, I looked up the programme information and my goodness, the whole thing is a vehicle for a motley collection of “comedians”, a couple of them from New Zealand and Australia, plus this rapper/ would-be comic called Dr Brown (I think), some creature who goes by the name Beardyman and is a beatboxer, if I remember right, while the comics grind out their puerile ramblings and karaoke-murder some music with the aid of a pianist and musicians to cover for this farrago. Ye gods.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/proms/whats-on/2011/august-13/46/programme-notes
All day long and STILL the comments about David Starkey on the Daily Mail website are unavailable! Yeah …. right. That paper is rapidly going downhill in my opinion – I wonder how long before La Toynbee is on the payroll?
Re Gilligan being howled down as stated above>
Noting now that Dimbleby on Any Questions was happy to quote verbatim what Harman said on Newsnight…and then get her to speak again about what she said in furtherance of the asociated tripe she`d already said!
This constituted a question then…tell us Harriet, would you like to rephrase what you had wanted to say before Gove stuck his oar in the other night?
A gentle underarm lob-but as we know Harman managed to stick her head throught the racket as ever!
Still-not for the want of trying by her pit props at the BBC-Dimbleby no doubt tending his turbines until the beastliness blows over!
“You May Not Like It, But David Starkey Was Right”
http://www.iaindale.com/posts/you-may-not-like-it-but-david-starkey-was-right
Thanks for that link, George.
The first comment by Demon :
“100% accurate – now how are we going to change this as I cannot see any of the current political parties even coming close to solving the problem….”
It’s worse than that. Not only are none of the current political parties close to solving the problem, they’re completely unwilling to even define it in an honest fashion. It’s left to an outspoken and brave historian to do it for them. Now watch them all either distance themselves from his remarks or condemn him for making them. Therein lies the even bigger problem.
Just went over to that link George and started banging my head on the table after reading the comments. I had to stop after reading Cee Law’s comments
I’m sorry, but how can you say “Jamaican Yardie Gangsta culture where gun crime, drugs and violence is glorified.”
What gives you the RIGHT to say that? I am Jamaican, a 21 year old Jamaican who was brought up in Jamaica. I have NEVER been in trouble with the law, don’t own a gun, never touched drugs and do NOT glorify violence.
Amazing how some people get all high handed. Nobody said Jamaican culture as a whole but a very specific aspect of it as was clearly stated.
As someone once said: For those who understand no explanation is neccessary for those who do not wish to understand no explantaion will suffice.
Having finally seen the video, all I can say is that Starkey screwed up big time. He said “black” culture right from the start when he should have said “gangsta”. When he went on to say that Lammy sounded white, it was an open goal the size of Texas. His own poor choice of words ended his argument before it began. Instead of saying “Jamaican” patois, he should have said “lowest common denominator”. What a tremendous waste of opportunity.
The BBC, of course, set this up beautifully: black woman educator with obligatory dreads aand a young progressive-sounding man for the youth connection versus old, white, posh-accented and out of touch.
Mad props, Beeboids. Booyakasha.
Hi David, I’m not sure about this.
David Starkey has been doing this sort of this on BBC programs for years*. They’ll have known what to expect – and as you say they set the situation up ok!
Starkey knew that as soon as he mentioned Enoch Powell, he’s got your attention. I was fearfully hanging on his every word as he said “Powell was ab-solutely right…” then Starkey did a switch and said “…about one thing.”
He was fairly clear to start with about a ‘particular form of gangster (“gangsta”) culture’. But he threw in the idea of “black culture” vs “white culture”
He knows very well that he’s sailing close to the wind. He also knew that it would spark a debate about what exactly he said, and whether it was right. He’s a clever guy, and will have been under no illusion about the furore that would follow
* I used to listen to the Moral Maze every week – superb stuff in those days 🙂
PS: ..and the debate is all over the internet. Especially in Twitter, which I think blogger Guido Fawkes correctly identified as a “left-wing echo chamber”
I know Starkey meant to be provocative, and rightly so. Poor choice of words ruined any chance he had to preach to anyone but the chorus. We’ve been having the same vital discussion in the US. But it works best by starting with how it harms black society, not how black behavior is bad when whites do it.
Don`t think that Starkey will mind being the butterfly in the wasps nest of the BBC just for one night.
The gagging reflex is in good shape alright.
Starkeys analysis of where Powell was right and then wrong was an education.
That Maitlis was drawn to his views in that nothing went through the panel withour him being the Pole Star, shows that the third rate tokens and nonenties can now boast of the time they were sat next to a brain in the BBC studios.
Mitchell will be scrabbling round Islington Primary workshops in two weeks time-and the white gag merchant will blog for the New Statesman and SWP.
Maitlis will stay forever in our pockets until we can rid ourselves of the blonde barnacles like her.
Starkey has got us thinking…at some cost to himself…so I appreciate that!