We are always being told just how crowded Gaza is….but that’s not really true in comparison to other places…..London, spread over a vastly bigger area, is still more crowded whilst Jordan is vastly underpopulated by comparison with only 68 people/km²….Jordan actually being ‘Palestine’ why then do all those Palestinian ‘refugees’ not find themselves a home there?
Somewhere on 5Live yesterday we were told that there is open space in Gaza, as Google Maps will confirm, but that if Hamas placed its military kit there it would get immediately blasted by the Israelis…so…they place them amongst the civilian population to hide it there…that ‘non-existent’ human shield that the BBC’s top Middle East expert likes to spout about.
There is no doubt a major problem because 100,000 or more have been uprooted. We shouldn’t belittle it.
I would suggest camps be set up in the open space but could Hamas be trusted not to operate from behind the displaced persons (factually they are not refugees)?
Sinai, has plenty of room but the Egyptians hate the Muslim Brotherhood and won’t let their fellow Arabs/Muslims out their side.
No Where To Hide
What they mean is they have no where to hide their rockets and other weapons other then in mosques, hospitals, and specially, UN run schools.
Poor Gazans and Hamas. No one likes them – even Egypt and Saudi Arabia.
Wisely, amongst personal chums of FaceBook, most have steered clear of any commentary on this topic. If religion and politics are no-nos in social gatherings, geo-political-religious bunfights probably best barge-poled.
One however tried a proactive rally effort that if she’d read it was actually naked incitement, and suddenly found she was unfollowed in a major way (sadly not an option BBC compellees enjoy). Ouch.
Another has simply posted this, and I think it worth the share because while certain aspects will please the dogmatic from either extreme not a jot, looks a fair attempt at a more balanced view from a publication usually out there with the pitchforks and torches when Stuart Hughes
initiates a campaigncoordinates the ‘reporting’.ttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/ali-a-rizvi/picking-a-side-in-israel-palestine_b_5602701.html
Certainly I am happy to set it along with the 40 questions of the Western MSM, which so far none seem to have got to interested in, oddly.
‘It means that this is not about who’s right or wrong as much as which tribe or nation you are loyal to.’
Not great but understandable for long-standing foes; truly so not good on any basis for supposedly professional, objective reporters or editors.
Just hope the author doesn’t suddenly find they have been sent to Helsinki and starts retracting. As can happen. Certainly the comments (and ‘likes’, taking his point about blind tribalism and noting which tribe can outweigh another simply on numbers of compliant warm bodies who can be mobilised, making paying such measures much heed facile) follow a predictable path almost immediately.
I agree 100% – factually they are not refugees – they are campers, living on the UN for the last several decades and ironically enough – no country will have them except for the one they want to destroy – Israel !
I’m a little confused why the UN hasn’t designated a number of safe zones you know like Srebrenica. Oh hang on, when I was in country it was a known fact that Bosnians would launch attacks agaisnt the Serbs and then scuttle back to safety. (I wonder why that snippet isn’t banded out more) Its one of the major reasons why the Serbs went it.
Oh and just for the record all 3 combatants in FRY were as bad as each other. If anything it was easier to deal with the Serbs than the other two.
Only quibble Ponce is “Muslims” not “Bosnians”. Using the word Bosnians for Muslims, suggests that the said Muslims are native to Bosnia. It is similar to the fiction of a people known as “Palestinians”, when in fact they are Egyptian Arabs.
The narrative has been thoroughly corrupted by Muslims and the Left. We find this in other places as well.
Burma – Rohingas instead of the fact that the Rohingas are Muslims are Bangladeshi settlers.
Kashmir – Muslims as Kashmiris instead of the fact the the only genuine Kashmiris are Hindus, who BTW have been driven out by Muslim invaders.
Only quibble Ponce is “Muslims” not “Bosnians”. Using the word Bosnians for Muslims,
There were 3 factions in F.R.Y
Bosniaks = Muslims
Serbs=Eastern Orthodox
Croats=Catholics.
We didn’t categorise them by faith, we categorised them by name. For example while you are quite correct to say that Bosnians are primarily Islamic, they drank alcohol, ate pork and had no problem allowing their women folk to marry out of the faith.
When I was there Muslims were as relgious as CoE are over here. Of course the rumination by Europe and the UN during the early days after the publishing of the Memorandum of the Serbian Academy of Sciences and Arts which led to radical Muslims moving to FRY to fight the good fight (And let me tell you, it was becasue of those relgious bigots that radical Islam is a growth industry inside Bosnia at the moment) once the war ended all of them were allowed to stay and they did.
But as I mentioned at the time, Muslims was just a name tag for a certain bunch of people and it meant…nothing.
At http://tinyurl.com/njbwbxa
BREAKING: IDF Captures Hamas Combat Manual Explaining Benefits of Human Shields SWC: “End double standard against Israel – hold Hamas accountable for crimes against Palestinians and Israelis”
BREAKING: IDF Captures Hamas Combat Manual Explaining Benefits of Human Shields SWC: “End double standard against Israel – hold Hamas accountable for crimes against Palestinians and Israelis”
A Hamas manual on “Urban Warfare” found by the Israeli Defense Forces makes it unmistakably clear that Hamas desires civilian casualties amongst its own people and encourages its fighters to engage in battles in civilian populated areas in order to draw an Israeli response.
“Where is the U.N. Human Rights Council? Where is Amnesty International? Where is Human Rights Watch? Where is the international media and Middle East pundits. Where are all the lawfare experts? Here is ‘Exhibit A’ to indict Hamas for war crimes and crimes against humanity by placing the people of Gaza as human shields,” said Rabbis Marvin Hier and Abraham Cooper, dean and founder and associate dean of the Simon Wiesenthal Center.
Keep this smoking gun as evidence of who the real war criminals are.
“Where is the U.N. Human Rights Council? Where is Amnesty International? Where is Human Rights Watch? Where is the international media and Middle East pundits. Where are all the lawfare experts
Yes where indeed? Where were and are all the bleeding hearts, as Christians in the ME and other Muslim countries are being slaughtered at a rate far worse then in Gaza and for much longer? Where is the BBC and others as Christians in Islamic countries are being driven out – “ethnically cleansed”?.
Bloody hypocrites- literally, as they have the blood of genuine innocents on their hands.
I’ll tell you where these bleeding hearts are. They are busy at the moment with the urgent question of whether WW1 could have been avoided one hundred years ago.
Anat
When I see these sanctimonious hypocrite politicians giving themselves plaudits, on the graves of the people who died because of the vanity of politicians, it fill me revulsion.
The BBC likes its Christians, only as long as they are of the intellectual calibre of Lucy Winkett(Thought For The Day-5.8.14).
No ISIS soulja would bother their arse in removing her…she is far more destructive to the Christian cause by staying there at St James, Piccadilly-and her abilty to read off a poster at St Brides,Fleet St was commendable(the journalists prayer).
Her “Thought” today implied that the Gospels have some accountability for the notion of slavery.
Jesus?…Paul?…all the same to her-it`s all gospels!
Who tried to teach this poppet in W1?…she is confusing Islam with Christianity…and putting Pauls teachings about slavery into the mouth of Jesus-who said nothing about slavery as a social ill whatsoever.
As I say-as Mosuls Christians beg for their lives and a plane ticket…they have the prospect of being “taught” their Gospels by the likes of Winkett and Fraser-if the BBC are to be believed.
I do think they should get rid of TFTD…it`s a mockery of faith, now that Sacks has gone.
Winkett etal are making Christianity the clown shoes for Islam or for the SWP. Carpet slippers for Choudhury at this rate.
ChrisH
Thanks for the heads-up on Lucy Winkett.
From Wiki, “Winkett writes, speaks and debates on a wide range of issues reflecting on culture, gender and religion”.
Now its not her fault what is written of her, but it comes as no surprise that her Christian faith comes after “culture” and, not surprisingly, “gender”.
Interesting diagram there. I know it’s a few years old, but that is surely balanced out by the fact it’s a UN document – after all, ‘UN document’ trumps most other factors for the BBC.
It’s amazing how the phrases so easily pop into the soundbite soliloquies which appear on the BBC, masquerading as analyses of the plight of the Gazans, along the lines of “….Israel is bombing one of the most densely populated areas in the world – nowhere to go – we must condemn Israel, just for that alone !”
But then you notice that Tel Aviv appears on that diagram also, rating at around 60% more densely populated than Gaza….. but how often have have I heard even one single peep from the BBC and its acolytes about the disgraceful rocket attacks aimed at the intensely populated city of Tel Aviv ? Cue tumbleweed, rolling in from stage left, in reply.
And before anyone takes off on one about how Gaza City is not the Gaza Strip…. and the city itself is vastly more populated than the Strip, the corollary to that is that there must therefore be lots of open space, then, for Hamas to fight from, thereby avoiding the deaths of civilians. They can’t have it every which way……well, other than from the BBC which seems to give so much leeway to Hamas on almost every front.
When I first visited Gaza in the 1990s I was expecting Hong Kong or Bangkok. After all it was the most densely populated place in the world.
I was very disappointed. Clearly those who still propagate the claim had never been there – or were blind.
Five Minutes for Israel has written about the myth of Gaza population density several times
FYI Population games
All wet in Gaza
Just dense
Good googling Alan, I see this is one of the first results for ‘Gaza population density’, even though it is now 6 years old.
If you’d looked at one of the other results, just a couple down you would’ve come across this….or maybe you did but it just didnt suit ‘the narrative’:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/07/14/gaza-city-is-being-hit-by-missile-strikes-this-is-how-densely-populated-it-is/
Strangely the same graphic appeared elsewhere a few days ago:
http://www.atangledweb.org/?paged=7
One has to wonder; are David and Alan the same person rather than two individuals sharing the same mindset?
You knew that your post was stupid before you pressed the Send button.
Strangely, when coll… fellow travellers have been getting excited about pseudonyms, dismissive of conspiracy theories or falling foul of grammar, you are never to be seen.
That and zero of late on BBC lack of accuracy, objectivity or integrity.
But a whole lot pondering on people.
No wonder at all.
Yes…see what you mean Moaty….
You are claiming Gaza is the most densely populated place on earth …and link to this quote, about Gaza city, not even Gaza, to prove it….
‘ According to Demographia, it is the 40th most densely populated urban area in the world.’
Good point, well made. Not.
Perhaps you can point out where I claimed ‘Gaza is the most densely populated place on earth ‘? I think you’ll have difficulty, because I didn’t.
I just pointed out how your point can be disputed and evidence to the contrary, and how you picked one interpretation to fit your narative.
Having failed to make the ghost of a good point, you can always delete my comments – that usually does the trick.
You were disputing the point I was making…that claims that Gaza is the most populated place on earth are false.
You provided ‘Evidence to the contrary’ did you? Really?
No. You didn’t. What you provided backed up my point.
And as you haven’t posted here before how can I have deleted any of your triffic insights? Or are you saying you post under many other names?
Keeping digging Al.
Anyone can use Google Earth and flick through just a score of photos to get a feel for what Gaza is like.
The towns look like most towns in the eastern Med – not especially affluent and not especially poor either – and the open spaces look pretty plentiful, though remarkably barren compared to the flourishing agriculture just over the border in hard-working Israel. I guess that’s what happens when all your aid money gets ploughed (no pun intended) into arms and tunnels.
Why should the Gazans work, when they can get far more and better food, and other stuff, then Egyptians over the border?
They aren’t that stupid.
Are the BBC able to tell us why Israel needs to end the blockade of Gaza?
Clearly Egypt isn`t about to do the same…why not discuss Israels stance on this, when Egypt and Gaza come to an agreement?
Bloody Egyptians blocking the peace process and all…
The Egyptians are well aware of who are the biggest problem causers in the area having been caught out by them on previous occasions. Hence their sensible blockade of Gaza.
The Egyptians are well aware of who are the biggest problem causers in the area having been caught out by them on previous occasions. Hence their sensible blockade of Gaza.
The strange thing is the horrific blockade of Gaza doesn’t seem to affect the supply of rockets and weapons moving freely into the area but only, conveniently for propaganda purposes, humanitarian items.
Hamas supports the Muslim Brotherhood. Unfortunately for them, the MB is not quite the flavour of the month with Pres SiSsi.
Just a thought.
As Gaza receives huge amount of money as outright gifts from the EU and the US, it has an economy that is artificial.
It also receives large amounts of Western high quality goods and medicines, free of cost. Given rampant corruption, most of these free goods end up on the market.
Now if the borders were open to both Israel and Egypt, Gazan traders will be able to undercut their Egyptian and Israeli counterparts. Which is not fair, or legal, according to WTO.
The only way Gaza can have open borders with Egypt and Israel is by
1. Stop terror attacks on Israel.
2. Stop supporting the MB in Egypt.
3. Refuse all aid money or goods, thus allowing a free and open market to operate.
And another to Gazans
Get off your collective butts, and get a proper job.
It’s been 20 years since I visited Gaza City but even then there were richer and poorer areas. While I was there one of Gaza’s then richest men was assassinated by Hamas supposedly for drug dealing. The charge was probably justified. He lived in a three story villa.
Depending on who makes the estimation there are between 600 to 1,700 Hamas millionaires in Gaza. They didn’t live in shacks.
I can’t speak for the condition of their dwellings since the 8th of July.
Palestinians were accepted in Jordan and were being allowed to make a home there until, that is, as is their usual behaviour, they decided that was not enough and the troublemakers amongst them decided they should grab power from the Jordanians and take control of the whole country. Fortunately for the Jordanians their leadership realised what was about to happen and kicked them out.
From there they moved into the Lebanon which, at the time, was a lovely peaceful country where Christians and the various Muslim groups live happily alongside each other having arranged matters so they shared power equally. Not long after the arrival of the Palestinians the Lebanon, as a result of Palestinian power demands, became embroiled in an horrific civil war whilst the Palestinians, who had settle on the border with Israel, used that location to fire rockets into the northern area of that country.
Problems in peaceful Jordan, problems in peaceful Lebanon and now problems in Gaza, and the common factor in creating trouble in all those places? Shh, whatever you do don’t try and tell the BBC.