General BBC-related comment thread:

Please use this thread for comments about the BBC’s current programming and activities. This post will remain at or near the top of the blog – scroll down for new topic-specific posts. N.B. this is not an invitation for general off-topic comments, rants or chit-chat. Thoughtful comments are encouraged. Comments may be moderated.

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118 Responses to General BBC-related comment thread:

  1. Lurker in a Burqua says:

    Do you think there is some enmity developing between BBC News and Sky News?


  2. Graeme Hunter says:

    In my opinoin, the standards of reporting on the BBC News is plummeting from a once revered factual, informative body to non-entity(read celebrity) promoting, facile innaccurate drivel. Who are the editors for this content. This morning on Radio 2 8:00am news The statement is that the “Governement is stunned. Did the bbec speak to the cabinet or any labour MP to get the quote “Stunned.” I doubt it. Why report this when it’s simply not true. We expect it of the tabloid press, not the bbc.


  3. Stephanie clague says:

    What is it about the BBC and its hatred for John Howard?
    BBC world is pushing a ‘Rudd is great’ because he will sign up to Kyoto, while ‘Howard is horrid’ because he doesnt want anything to do with Kyoto!
    What is the BBC trust doing while the BBC makes itself look ridiculous and dishonest?
    Labour party activists like Andrew Marr Etc have destroyed any reputation that the BBC had and I ask, are they are proud of what they have done?


  4. Abandon Ship! says:


    A good example of this was on the Today programme at around 7.20 this morning, which went out of its way to promote a negative image of Howard (“dog whistle politics” was used for example when referring to Howard) but, surprise, surprise, a positive one of Rudd (“speaks Cantonese fluently”).

    Dreadful stuff.


  5. Pete says:

    The BBC has announced it is going to remake the 70’s series Survivors, where a small band of people live on after a global catastrophe. In the 70’s it was a plague. Will the BBC be able to resist making it global warming, GM crops run amok or a nuclear power station meltdown this time around?


  6. Rueful Red says:

    I listened to “Toady” for an hour this morning, and apart from a mention during the press review, the loss of the personal records of 25 million people wasn’t mentioned once. This despite the fact that the story seems to have got fresh legs in the broadsheet press.

    BBC: idiosyncratic news values.


  7. Lee Moore says:

    Another of those BBC voter’s panels where, surprise surprise, the supporters of the left wing party outnumber the supporters of the right wing party. It’s 3-2 for Aussie Labor, and one “a plague on both their houses.”)

    But while the three Labor supporters are enthusiastic Labor supporters and vigorous Howard-haters (and all from Melbourne for some reason) the two Liberal supporters are hardly typical of Howard supporters :

    I will vote for John Howard and the Liberal Party. Not with a great deal of enthusiasm, but because there’s no better alternative. I would like to see a more socially liberal Australia, more tolerant towards immigration, homosexuality, indigenous rights and workplace diversity.

    In the future I would like to see Australia having an image of a greener, more eco-friendly country that leads the way in renewable technology.

    They’re much more attuned to BBC values than a typical Howard voter.


  8. The Fat Contractor says:

    Graeme Hunter | 23.11.07 – 8:13 am |
    Yes, why on earth would the Government be stunned when they knew about this problem several weeks ago …?

    Pete | 23.11.07 – 9:21 am |
    Oh no! Not ‘Survivors’. I love that series – I was even watching the first series on VHS last night. It was a hopelessly middle class, daft, brilliant mess that sparked the imagination rather than being purely entertaining. Thought provoking stuff. I hate to think how they will explain the virus escaping these days. Government lab or private one? Or perhaps a terrorist attack by Fathers-For-Justice or the BNP.

    It will be PC crap.


  9. Martin says:

    Yes. Even Radio 5 lite have decided that some old fart not getting his Passport checked at an airport is MORE important than 25 million missing back account details.

    Or the comments from retired military commanders about Brown’s utter hatred of the armed forces.

    Or Northern rock.

    All of the above have had new revelations (serious ones as well) in the papers today, yet 5 Lite and their little cheerleader queen Victoria Derbyshire want to talk about airport security instead.


  10. John Gentle says:

    To follow the last post re. the Australian election, this bias is offensive not just because it is imbalanced but also because it leads to very inaccurate forecasting. For example, in 2004 BBC Reporters (and there were, I believe, 180 of them!) overwhelmingly were predicting a Kerry victory and a heavyish defeat for Bush. Bias and inaccuracy.


  11. backwoodsman says:

    Oh dear, these beeboids don’t know when to stop digging ! Marr & Robinson are completely discredited and subject to pages of derisive comments on every blog. What do they do, Marr makes a factually inaccurate attack on SKY news and Robinson chooses the suicidal course of fronting a nulab attack on the former defense chiefs , claiming its a plot against the Dear Leader !
    Has he tried reading the forces blogs ? Hasn’t he seen the utter contempt brown is held in by serving personnel, stemming from his period at the treasury and his recent photo op fiasco ??
    It really should be the end for Robinson, I for one feel a missive to the govenors comming on.


  12. Reimer says:

    Re ‘Newsnight’ item on the Aussie election 22/11: does Howard use the ‘Winston’ bit of his name himself, or was its repeated use by the BBC hack a bit of sneering?


  13. will says:

    Pete | 23.11.07 – 9:21 am “The BBC has announced it is going to remake the 70’s series Survivors, where a small band of people live on after a global catastrophe”

    Which brings us back to Spooks. It seems to me that whilst its anti-American theme will please its lefty supporters, Muslims may be more ambivilent. The Iranian diplomat drinks whisky & wants to stand by his immodest, adulterous wife whose pregnancy may produce a blond, blue eyed child.

    Anyway, now that the UK far right have put in an appearance there is only one faction missing – the Jews. Perhaps their role is to provide the global catastrophe by bombing the newly nuclear Iran.


  14. John Reith says:

    John Gentle | 23.11.07 – 9:57 am

    …it leads to very inaccurate forecasting. For example, in 2004 BBC Reporters (and there were, I believe, 180 of them!) overwhelmingly were predicting a Kerry victory….

    This is untrue.

    The BBC did not predict a Kerry victory in 2004.

    That’s just another fabrication given currency by commenters at Biased-BBC.

    Here are some reports from the last 11 days of campaigning:

    George W Bush and John Kerry have been making last-ditch attempts to win support on the final day of campaigning in the US presidential election.

    Both men spent Monday targeting key marginal states which could decide the battle for the White House, a race deemed too close to call.
    The BBC’s Justin Webb in Washington says neither candidate can be sure of a win, and the last day may be decisive…

    With the latest opinion polls showing the two men neck-and-neck, both made last-minute appeals to Americans to make sure they cast their votes on Tuesday, hoping that a final turnout of undecided voters will work in their favour.

    With the race so close, there are fears of a repeat of 2000’s disputed result and subsequent legal wrangling.

    Both camps were wrapping up their campaigns with a record number of last-minute advertisements.

    In the final hours of campaigning, they were less seeking new converts than trying to get all their supporters out on election day.

    President George W Bush and his Democratic challenger John Kerry are both campaigning in Ohio and Florida on Sunday, with Mr Kerry making an additional stop in New Hampshire.
    They are trying to court every last voter they can in the eight to 10 states that are so close it makes the outcome on Tuesday difficult to predict.
    US votes in election cliffhanger

    The polls have started closing as one of the tightest US presidential elections in memory draws to a close.

    Final opinion surveys showed Republican President George W Bush and his Democratic challenger John Kerry neck-and-neck.

    The BBC’s Justin Webb in Washington says polls suggest the outcome of the election is still too close to call, although President Bush has a slight edge……..


  15. Chuffer says:

    This gem from Helen Rumbelow, the Times’ TV reviewer:

    “Whenever an article comes up on a news website about continuing job cuts at the BBC, a whole slew of BBC insiders post comments underneath. Many, interestingly, confess that the cuts are long overdue, giving insider denunciations of wasters and skivers.Even more telling: that they have the time in their working day for long posts on news websites.


  16. will says:

    The BBC’s delight at the dollar decline (e.g. prominent news reports on the currency arrangements of rappers & models), a part of their anti-Americanism has always acted as a dog whistle for those who have rushed to comment on HYS urging oil producers to switch to pricing in euros.

    You have to be careful that you are not biting off your nose

    Airbus’ chief executive has said the dollar’s decline is “life-threatening”.
    Thomas Enders said the exchange rate had gone “beyond the pain barrier”.

    The BBC add The plane maker says this favours it arch-rival, Boeing.

    Well I declare, how on earth have Boeing survived all these years of an overpriced $?


  17. Allan@Oslo says:

    For example, in 2004 BBC Reporters (and there were, I believe, 180 of them!) overwhelmingly were predicting a Kerry victory and a heavyish defeat for Bush. Bias and inaccuracy.
    John Gentle | 23.11.07 – 9:57 am | #

    JR’s objection is correct. Replace ‘predicting’ with ‘hoping for’. I remember that reporting: possibly the most biased in the BBC’s history, and that is no exaggeration. Now it appears that John Howard is getting the Bush-treatment.


  18. Jim Miller says:

    John Reith’s set of quotations from the BBC support the argument that BBC reporters were biased in their coverage of the 2004 American election.

    You’ll note that all of them say the election is “too close to call”, or “neck and neck”, or something similar. In fact, Bush had a small edge in the polls, taken all together, and a bigger edge in most of the economic models that have been used to predict American elections.

    That’s why I predicted a narrow win for Bush in my final election prediction.

    That kind of mistake, the overestimation of your own side’s chances, is typical of partisans. If Reith’s quotations are a fair summary of the coverage, then we have one more reason to think that the BBC is unable to treat American Republicans fairly.

    (Allan in Oslo is probably right about the “hoping for”. But “hoping for” often distorts “predicting”, as it seems to have done in this case.)


  19. Jim Miller says:

    Credit where due to Justin Webb for correct reporting on the 2004 election — assuming that “slight edge” fragment is representative. But all the rest of the predictions that “John Reith” cites are wrong.


  20. bodo says:

    Astonishing performance from the BBC business editor Robert Peston this morning on Radio 4 at about 7:10 a.m. he is making a bit of a habit of parroting the official government line on controversial stories.

    He was defending the government over the sale of Qinetiq, which has come in for much criticism by a Parliamentary committee. He explained how the privatisation had been a fantastic success, and then despite efforts by the studio to finish the interview he insisted “can I just had a little bit more?” To which the studio replied “yes but be brief”. He then spent at least 60 seconds explaining how the staggering windfall profits that turned 20 civil servants into multi-millionaires were entirely justified. I thought it was a government spokesman until the studio finished with “that was our business reporter”.


  21. Andrew says:

    Since we’re on the subject of the BBC and the last US election, let’s take a trip down memory lane to the public musings of one Hannah Bayman, a Beeboid and a Brigadista, known, among other things, for ‘Rocking around the blockade’ on a Revolutionary Communist Group trip (“two weeks soaking up the sun, sea, salsa and socialism of this revolutionary island”) to Cuba (I am really interested in the Pioneers and the UJC (Union of Young Communists)), who blogged her hopes that:

    “…the US chooses a candidate who stands for international relationships, abortion rights, medical research, secular values and taxes on the richest… instead of a warmongering, oil-grubbing, vote-rigging, drink-driving – haven’t you seen Fahrenheit 9/11? – weapons-of-mass-destruction-buying, Kyoto-smashing, bible-bashing, chimp.”

    Then on the big night:

    “So it is all about Ohio, the third of the swing states. NBC and Fox have already called Ohio for the chimp, but I think I will wait for my colleagues at BBC News Online (remember Fahrenheit 9/11).”

    And the crushing of many a Beeboid hope:

    “I was woken first thing by two pessimistic texts from a colleague working the early shift at BBC Telly Centre, saying it would take a miracle for a Kerry victory”

    * last spotted working for the BBC in Guernsey – doubtless poised to report when the Guernsey UJC join the revolution of their Cuban brothers and sisters… 🙂


  22. Bryan says:

    The World Service simply can’t let a day go by without trying to discredit the Americans. At 15:00 GMT yesterday we had the following. (I paraphrase):

    American forces ARE MAKING MUCH OF THE FACT that attacks by insurgents have been reduced as a result of the surge BUT today al Qaeda killed 3 soldiers and 8 members of a Sunni council against al Qaeda.

    Would be nice if the subversive BBC would just come straight out and say it:

    We support the insurgents in this war.

    But that would require honesty.


  23. Bryan says:

    Andrew | Homepage | 23.11.07 – 2:28 pm

    What do these dumb BBC lefties have against chimps anyway? I would have thought they would be all for animal rights – as opposed to rights for humans such as Israelis, Americans, Australians…


  24. David Gregory (BBC) says:

    If I’d know revealing my true feelings would have lead to a plum post at BBC Guernsey I would have blogged about my love for Cuba and all things Castro long ago! 🙂


  25. Newshour says:

    On Howard:

    I just heard Nick Bryant say on Newshour (World Service) ‘Australia has punched above its weight during the John Howard years…’, not exactly wearing a Rudd Earwax T-Shirt is he?

    On BBC ‘bias’ in 2004:
    On the live election night programme, the guest was pollster Bob Worcester, the commment, ‘I’m calling it, it’s going to be President Kerry’. The channel, ITV News.


  26. Newshour says:

    bodo | 23.11.07 – 2:16 pm |

    On Peston from this morning’s Toady…you can’t have it both ways. If Peston had joined the chorus of criticism over Qinetiq, you’d have said he was guilty of typical BBC anti-business bias, the kind which Jeff Randall has consistently (and often rightly) criticised.

    As it is he explains pretty clearly I thought why the private sector investors and management team had earned their money; a useful counterbalance to the critical report this morning, but according to you he is ‘parroting the official government line ‘.

    What can you do?


  27. John Gentle says:

    I distinctly remember that tub-o-lard Mark Mardell saying on election day (when he was the interviewer!) something like “surely there’s no way Bush can win” (tone of contempt, Newsnight, November 2004).

    By the way, do Andrew Marr and Nick Robinson have joint appointments to the BBC and the Labour Government?


  28. MattLondon says:

    The BBC’s delight at the dollar decline (e.g. prominent news reports on the currency arrangements of rappers & models),

    It wasn’t just the Beeb who were reporting this – as I pointed out at the time the Telegraph (and lots of others) had fun with the model story too.

    Airbus’ chief executive has said the dollar’s decline is “life-threatening”.
    Thomas Enders said the exchange rate had gone “beyond the pain barrier”.

    The BBC add The plane maker says this favours it arch-rival, Boeing.

    Well I declare, how on earth have Boeing survived all these years of an overpriced $?

    In my narrow little world I assume that the Airbus concern – and the basis for the BBC’s comment – lies in the fact that Boeing are Airbus’s only real competitor and a rise in the Euro against the dollar of the present magnitude significantly damages Airbus’s competitive position.
    Re Boeing’s “survival” – lots of reasons. They make good planes, without till recently much competition in their main markets, and almost non producing in non-dollar markets.

    You don’t have to be anti American to wonder, rather, how the dollar managed to stay so high for so long. One reason I’ve avoided blandishments to invest any savings in dollar securities. I might be a bit more ready to do so now.


  29. Diogenes says:

    For some strange reason BBC News 24 do not seem to be mentioning that the good ship Explorer navigated the Northwest Passage in 1984.

    Surely this fact is perfect testament to the seaworthiness of this vessel in cold conditions.

    Even if it does rather ruin the narrative of these intrepid BBC explorers.


  30. David Preiser says:

    Andrew | 23.11.07 – 2:28 pm

    Now I know who was feeding Katty Kay lines when she was interviewing Mike Huckabee. If Ms. Bayman’s job in Guernsey doesn’t work out for her, Matt Frei probably has a slot for her (if his small budget allows) on his upcoming US election discussion panels.


  31. Chris says:

    I expect the MV Explorer sailed the Northwest passage searching for those mythical creatures Polar Bears that died out in the medieval warm period don’t you!


  32. amimissingsomething says:

    on the eve of one of the bush election victories (yes, jr, i forget which), guess who the bbc (not in the uk) had on tv as (the sole) guest commentator?

    eleanor clift

    need i say more?


  33. pounce says:

    The BBC, politically correct reporting, Aids and half the bloody story.

    Sex infections continue to rise
    The sexual health of young UK adults worsened in 2006 despite a concerted public health effort to turn it around, figures show. In 2006, a total of 376,508 new sexually transmitted infections (STIs) were diagnosed – up 2.2% on 2005, the Health Protection Agency found. Young people aged 16-24 made up the bulk of cases of some of the most common STIs, including chlamydia. The HPA also warned of a continuing HIV and STI epidemic in gay men.
    An estimated 73,000 adults are now living with HIV in the UK. A third of the people in Britain with HIV, don’t know they have the virus. HIV transmission seems to be a particular problem among gay men – the HPA anticipates that there will have been just over 2,700 new diagnoses of HIV infection among this population in 2006.

    And here is what the Health Protection Agency (HPA) from which the BBC quotes in its report actually said;
    Almost half of the estimated 7,800 HIV diagnoses in 2006were in black Africans and 3% were in black Caribbean’s. An estimated 4.0% of the black African population of England, Wales and Northern Ireland (E, W & NI) were living with diagnosed HIV infection, as were 0.4% of the black Caribbean population, compared with 0.08% of the white population…HIV prevalence in UK-born pregnant women giving birth in 2006 was highest (0.47%) in those with male partners born in the Caribbean or Central America, and was0.33% in those with male partners born in sub-Saharan Africa.

    Strange how the BBC paints a picture of a white British youth problem when it comes to Aids and not immigration.

    The BBC, politically correct reporting, Aids and half the bloody story.


  34. Fran says:

    Nostalgia ain’t what it used to be.

    Reading John Reith’s list of links to the BBC not predicting Kerry’s defeat took me back to the happy day in 1994 listening to the Bush House-in-Mourning as their man romped in, er, second. The subdued voices, the anguished analysis, even an assertion on PM that Kerry appealed to the ‘rational’ voter.

    Honestly, you’d have to have had a heart of stone not to laugh.


  35. David Preiser says:

    The BBC have reconsidered their interpretation of US gun-crime statistics. I’ll let Prof. Volokh explain, as he is at least partially responsible for the correction:

    It seems to be a stealth edit, naturally, as is often the case with these accidental errors. But I have this vague impression of an odd coincidence of the subject matter and the statistical distribution of these kinds of errors….


  36. David Preiser says:

    Sorry, link directly to the relevant post from Prof. Volokh is here:


  37. Anonymous says:

    Pounce – yes the BBC is determined to keep the public ignorant about the reason for the increasing AIDS figures. Very rarely do they mention immigration. I can only assume it is their official policy.

    Even the Guardian dares to reveal
    the awkward truth.,,2215956,00.html
    Three-fifths of new HIV infections diagnosed in the UK last year were acquired abroad, according to the HPA. Black Africans accounted for half the total number of new HIV infections last year. More than four-fifths (84%) of them contracted HIV in Africa.


  38. Laban says:

    Fran – 1994 ? 2004 surely ?

    What a day that was :

    “What a beautiful day. The sun shining, trees in their autumn plumage, woodsmoke in the keen air.

    And the Daily Mirror’s “How Could You”, the Indie’s black-bordered front page, the solemn, mournful music on all BBC channels, broadcasting having been suspended for three days. For the first time since the Dunkirk evacuation of 1940, Archbishop Rowan Williams is arranging a Service of Intercession at Westminster Abbey, begging God’s aid in our hour of grief, distress and need.

    A Christian should not gloat. But we are all sinners who fall short of grace.

    A Samizdata commentator mentioned the stony faces of BBC staff in Washington yesterday. In the Black Country they have an appropriate phase for such a facial expression :

    “like a bulldog licking p*** off a nettle”

    Still to come – the pleasures of the Guardian and BBC talkboards, urban75, the New Statesman. Is this what Abram Maslow called a ‘Peak Experience’ ? Haven’t felt like this since May 2nd, 1997, but that’s another story.

    I whistle the ‘Star Spangled Banner’, the car resounds with Hayseed Dixie, Bob Wills and the Sons of the Pioneers.”


  39. Zevilyn says:

    The BBC, and indeed much of the media, has given Gordo a very easy ride over his treatment of the armed forces.

    Strange, how when US generals criticised the Bush Admin, the BBC was much more eager.


  40. Susan says:

    David P.:

    In case you didn’t know, Hannah Bayman used to comment on this very blog, many moons ago. If I am not mistaken, she was the very first Beeboid to post here non-anonymously.


  41. Zevilyn says:

    The amount of coverage given to McClaren’s sacking was not what one should expect from what is supposed to be a serious new organisation.

    Sports news should be confined to the sports news section. US News progs don’t give the ridiciulous prominence to footy that Brtisih Tv news does.


  42. Anonymous says:

    pounce | 23.11.07 – 6:41 pm |

    Sex infections continue to rise

    HIV Cases Almost Double In Just 10 Years

    Read these two versions of the same story. They show the true PC bias of the bbc.


  43. Sproggett says:

    I hope Hannah has calmed down a bit. Hopefully the Channel Islands air will have soothed her nerves though, as a good socialist she undoubtedly is, I am sure she deeply resents being forced to live in a well-to-do tax-haven like Guernsey.


  44. Reg Hammer says:

    As well as dodging the dreaded ‘m’ word in their reports, Al Beeb can’t seem to stop making excuses for muslim killers, no matter how lame.

    “In all cases, the alleged killers were nationalist-minded young men or even teenagers.

    Turkish nationalists often view missionaries as a threat, especially in remote places like Malatya, says the BBC’s Sarah Rainsford in Istanbul. ”

    The monkey tennis blog does a good analysis of it all:

    “Most reasonable people will, of course, be able to infer from the report that the killers were Muslim, but the BBC deliberately plays down the religious angle, and plays up the ‘nationalism’ line for all it’s worth. And it’s not hard to see why.

    In the eyes of the BBC and other soft-leftists Islamism either isn’t a danger at all; is a minor irritation that isn’t worth confronting; or is perhaps a more serious problem, but one which can’t be addressed due to considerations of multi-culturalism and political correctness.

    Nationalism, on the other hand, is seen by the Left as an all-too-real and pressing threat; and fortunately for the world the solutions to the problem are simple: the transference of more power to transnational institutions like the EU and the UN, and the increased migration of peoples to the point where ideas of nationality become meaningless.

    As well as insulting the intelligence of its readers, the BBC is also insulting the tens of millions of Turkish people who are able to make a clear distinction between the state and Islam.”

    Keep up the good work Al Beeb. Your seven virgins await.


  45. Reg Hammer says:

    Another bit of selective reporting from the Beeb. This time regarding 3 black youths who kicked one white youth to death in the street for ‘Pushing past them.’

    Read the same reports here:-

    However, the BBC choose to omit one line from the report that no-one else omitted.

    “Yateman, of Colindale, north London, smirked in the dock as the victim’s father Kenny Page read out a victim impact statement, telling how he had gone “through hell” over his son’s death.”

    The BBC. Covering up racial hate crime. It’s what we do.


  46. Fran says:


    Quite right – 2004. My memory, like nostalgia, isn’t what it used to be ..


  47. johnj says:

    The BBC’s Rupert Wingfield-Hayes casually “discovers” a victim of the Neo-Nazis unstoppable rise in Russia. OMG we even see him strolling outside without gloves on in the snow in that trusted BBC Attenborough mode announcing his hopeful encounter with, not an exotic species, but a victim in the unloved capitalist jungle that is Russia

    “I’ve now come out to the edge of Moscow….I’ve been told that a young Uzbeck man is here……so I’ve come here to see if I can try and find him”

    Without gloves on? And then, in the next shot, we see him cosily chatting with the same man. What if he had gone all that way and hadn’t found him? Such intrepid factual BBC Nature reporting. Why do they lie in front of the camera and make it seem as if it is all spontaneous and so intrepid? Why can’t he say that his editor and the camera team have already made a prior appointment with him for an interview? BBC lies, par for the course, in what must be one of the most duplicitous news org. on the planet. Thankfully now, being exposed on a daily basis. Note the BBCs use of the Nazi swastika in this film, surely an insult to the 20 million Russians who died fighting Hitler?

    Russia is witnessing a rise in racially-motivated attacks committed by neo-Nazis.
    (Thursday, BBC Video and Audio)


  48. David says:

    “…In a victim impact statement his father, Kenny Page, said the family went “through hell”.

    Mr Page’s mother said: “When my son’s life was taken, part of my own life was taken as well.””

    Will Mr and Mrs Page get OBEs in due course? I doubt it.


  49. Oscar says:

    We support the insurgents in this war. But that would require honesty.
    Bryan | 23.11.07 – 2:35 pm | #

    Similarly John Humphrys on Toady this morning announced with gusto that Annapolis is bound to fail. The sheer relish he takes in the prospect of failed peace talks, rather like the glee at the prospect of civil war in Iraq, is pretty grotesque. Like the continuing harping on about involving Hamas – even after the mini massacre at the demo to commemorate Arafat’s death. (boy did that news get buried fast). The BBC has also wiped all references to the Road Map with the formula that Annapolis marks the first SERIOUS talks for seven years. – presumably in their view the Road Map negotiations were just for fun.