I just saw this story and like most others, I am shocked at this wicked act of murder that has taken place at a Jewish seminary in west Jerusalem. However from this poorly written (or is it?) BBC story you would struggle to even see this as an act of premeditated murder. Consider the language – the culprits were “gunmen” apparently. No they weren’t – they were dedicated Palestinian terrorists who used guns to kill the young Jewish students. You have to read down quite a bit to you get to the “Hamas praise” heading. Indeed Hamas do praise those who have brought death to these religious seminary, but the BBC helpfully adds that those who study here identify with the leadership of the Jewish settlement movement – who believe the West Bank should be in Jewish and not Palestinian hands. Mmm, and the BBC also remind us that Israeli forces launched a raid into northern Gaza in which more than 120 Palestinians – including many civilians – were killed. No insight provided into where this 120 deaths figure comes from, or how many were Hamas terrorists. I’m sorry to have to keep banging on this Middle East theme (will change tomorrow!) but I think this report is almost written from the viewpoint that the Jews were just asking for this kind of act of reprisal. I also notice that at the very bottom of the page this act of mass murder is described as an “incident”. Pure bloody bias.
THE JERUSALEM “INCIDENT”.
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on BBC News 24 they used the t word as the news was breaking. But I can’t imagine them sticking to it.
Hettie,
Must have been a typo.
I just heard about this. On American PRI radio (NPR), a BBC co-production, I heard a BBC reporter describing this. She referred to the terrorists simply as gunmen, with the only description of them as being “described as dressed like the students.” There was no reference to Palestinians, however, the reporter felt the need to add that the school was tied to conservative settlers who wanted the West Bank settled by Israeli’s and not Palestinians.
Note how they call it a “raid” in the headline, as if it was an attack on a military target. I have submitted a quick online complaint.
Dutch news have no problem using the word ‘Terrorist’, they also mentioned that people in Gaza are firing guns in the air in joy!.
I just checked the Belgium news and they to are using the word ‘Terrorist’, it seems that only the BBC have problems using the correct definiton for this murderous and inhumane attack on innocent people.
Mark Urban has a piece on Newsnight this evening about Gaza, I wonder if his piece will have to be doctored to remove the normal BBC support for Hamas scum?….
Utterly speechless. Can we imagine the BBC carrying a story of Palestinian students being killed in such a way? It would be “Israelis kill seven innocent Palestinian students, including three babies” (with accompanying pictures of the regular baby and old woman shots). And to use the word “people” is sinister. Why not “Seven Students”? As for the headline “Gunmen kill seven in Israeli raid” – “Raid” gives the meaning of a military operation, not cold blooded murder. The headline should read “Palestinian Terrorists Murder Seven Unarmed Israeli Students” which far more accurately captures the situation.
Originally it was called an “accident”. I have the screen capture but they’ve edited it now
For making quick complaints to the BBC:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/complaints/make_complaint_step1n.shtml
or call 0870 010 0222 now.
“Raid” – For BBC Hamas thugs that are firing rockets indiscriminately without caring about their own or their enemy’s civilians are “rocketeers”.
So in their book, this is a naturally a “daring raid” on a military target. Unarmed Israeli students well within 67′ borders deserve it, of course.
Cheers DV,
I have just clicked on the link and sent my complaint.
It takes all of two minutes to send in a complaint and I suggest that everyone should do the same and complain about the BBC’s usage of the word ‘Accident’ to explain what was in fact a terrorist attack on innocent people.
My thoughts and sympathy are with our Israeli friends.
“Incident” is an improvement on the original.
Earlier this evening on BBC News 24 there was a 4 minute discussion between the studio presenter and Jeremy Bowen. Rather than concentrate on the terrorist attack Bowen used 3 of the 4 minutes to explain why Israel should still be regarded as the occupying force in Gaza. Incredible.
Hmm, apparently no one was murdered in Israel tonight. They were killed. And not by a terrorist. Simply an assailant.
And apparently the BBC are in the nature of predicting the future. Apparently Jeremy Bowen says, “the Israeli government will be under immense pressure to respond – and it will, even though it is not known when and where precisely”. How does Mr Bowen know Israel WILL respond? It is likely they will respond, not definite like Mr Bowen makes out.
The BBC has a long history of pointing fingers at Israel right after the country suffers a terrorist attack. It’s almost become a tradition of BBC “reporting” to attack Israel at these times and we had more of the same tonight. The complaining “journalist” interviewing the Israeli ambassador to the UK was predictably reading from the BBC rule book. That is, be sure to bash Israel after its citizens suffer a terror attack:
This incident has tragically taken place in Jerusalem and what it must say to you Israelis is that your problem is not only confined to Gaza but you have a problem dealing with the impact of the occupation right across Israel.
There’s that incident again. And the BBC really should learn to distinguish between a tragedy and an atrocity. To translate from BBC-speak, an occupation that ceased years ago somehow still has an impact and is still causing a problem.
You have clear strategy in dealing with the effects of the occupation and clearly it’s not working. Earlier in our programme we had one member of a UN agency saying you have simply created more extremism, particularly among Gaza residents.
OK, OK we get the message. Arab terrorists bear no responsibility for terror. It’s simply the effects of the occupation and only the Israelis can be blamed for Arab terror. How convenient.
Israel has a serious partner, a credible partner in peace, Mahmoud Abbas, and he himself has said that the current Israeli strategy is making life very difficult for him. He’s calling on the Israelis to lift, for instance, the blockade which is meting out collective punishment on the Gazan people of whom he’s the legitimate president.
Look, you’ve got a friend and you’re hurting him and his own people. Why don’t you stop?
Our journalist then went on to ask some sensible questions about the impact of the attack on the talks between Egypt and Hamas about brokering a ceasefire, proving that the BBC can actually do its job at times. And yes, she actually called it an attack. Perhaps the ambassador’s no-nonsense answers to her terrorist-friendly questions had an effect.
While the interview was in progress, BBC TV showed images from the scene in Jerusalem. The caption read: Israel Violence. Lousy writers the BBC has. It almost makes it seem like Israel was responsible for the violence. I wonder why the BBC would want to create that impression:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7282269.stm
Click on Israel attack ‘appals’ ambassador.
David Vance:
Must have been. I saw the BBC was back on “form” soon after.
“The BBC has a long history of pointing fingers at Israel right after the country suffers a terrorist attack.”
Bryan
They must suppress their cognitive dissonance. The narrative is written by them, and contradictions are to be wished away, the bbc had to move on (or rather back to the narrative) quickly. But this quickly?
Will the BBC give prominence to, and comment on, the morality of this?:-
“Thousands of Gazans Celebrate Jerusalem School Slaughter”
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/03/thousands-of-gazans-celebrate-jerusalem.html
Hettie, sorry I don’t understand the point you’re making.
Here is what i posted,im not very good with words like you guys but we must do our bit:-
“You refer this as a raid, you name the victims simply as “people” you dont call them school students.
You also almost blame these students because they were in a Jewish school. Would you use the same soft language if the people killed were muslims in a madrassa, by Jewish gunmen?
Hamas people are firing there guns in the air at this slaughter of INNOCENT STUDENTS, how come you dont report this? Your journalism is disgustingly anti semitic and very very very racist – the thing is as an ENGLISH [yes we exist] person i have to fund this racism! In your 19:58 web bulletin you labelled this murder in a school an “ACCIDENT” – your job at the BBC is to REPORT – NOT SHAPE the news with a racist jew hating slant – which is what you have done here,imagine describing Dunblane as an “accident”. I hope you revolting people typing this crap will one day face up to your disgusting slanted racism. I doubt you will though – after all people firing rockets at ashkelon are called “rocketeers” in your book – anywhere else they are indiscriminate murderers.
Disgusting racism at the BEEB – and you are so slanted and live in such a culture of denial you cant even see it – for instance – supplant the word “israel” with “Yemen” every time you write an article – see how it looks with your 3rd reich specs on eh? PLEASE i cannot wait for the day when i dont have to fund this crap! Your time will come BBC -a party will get in power one day and give you guys the boot! It can only happen soon. Working class of multicultural very left wing city here, and proud of it. What disgusting journalism.”
on the front page of the bbc news headline it currently says
“eight killed in jerusalem school”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/
as if a fire broke out, or maybe there was an accident in a science lab…
note how different the tone of that headline is to the usual “Israel kills…” kind of headlines, which no doubt will happen tommorow when the IDF respond.
mass celebrations in gaza…
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2008/03/mass-celebrations-in-gaza-just-what-you.html
“There is a right and a wrong, there is a morality and an immorality here. Israel’s failure to be 100% perfect in every minute detail does not take away from the fact that it is light-years ahead of its celebrating Gaza neighbors in morality. A culture that strives for peace, for co-existence, for personal and collective achievement is simply not comparable to the animals who celebrate the deaths of innocents.”
“Unspeakable”
(Melanie Phillips).
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/543761/unspeakable.thtml
Eight killed at Jerusalem school
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7282269.stm
How would the BBC try to justify this?
………..
The fact that the school is at the heart of the settler movement in the occupied West Bank may have been the reason why it was targeted, BBC Middle East editor Jeremy Bowen reports.
Many of its students are on special courses that combine religious study with service in combat units in the Israeli army, he notes.
……….
“Surely You’re Joking”
(Hugh Fitzgerald).
http://www.newenglishreview.org/blog_direct_link.cfm/blog_id/13438
The BBC is deliberately being simplistic in it’s coverage.It looks as if Israel is undergoing an orchestrated increase in terrorist attacks with the aim of forcing a military response which the BBC and fellow travelling media outlets can then present as “aggression ” or “disproportionate”.Then if Syria/Iran take military action it can be presented as an inevitable result of Israeli aggression.The pressure will then be on Israel to back down and on the Western powers to offer no assistance to Israel.The BBC is becoming part of the problem not just a news agency.
Look at this piece of unvarnished, pure, propaganda from the Beeb. Unbelievable.
It’s like a fake-out in boxing. They set you up with the left (the Israeli woman’s letter) then they power punch you with the right (the Palestinian woman’s letter.) It’s absolutely, completely biased and by making it seem like it’s supposed to be a balanced portrayal of two lives, it’s that much more sinister and insidious.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/talking_point/7270785.stm
The word to use is MURDER (= illegal, premeditated killing, not in self-defence)- which is how Yitzhak Rabin described the massacre of Arabs by Baruch Goldstein in Hebron in 1994:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/february/25/newsid_4167000/4167929.stm
Does the BBC doubt for one moment that this was an act of mass MURDER?
Why are they unable or unwilling to use this word?
Just heard on ‘TOADY’ that the school was a centre of Zionism and the settler movement!
The BBC just had to slip in a justification for murder didnt they? Does it matter that many of the dead were unarmed children? How old were the victims? The BBC seemed to forget the uncomfortable facts?
The BBC line consists of blame the Jews wherever possible and justify the murder of Jews wherever possible?
You can almost hear the BBC Hammas supporters crying with joy at Israels distress!
Hammas use women,children,hospitals and schools as human shields to protect their rocket launchers and seem to look forward to the deaths of their own women and children as a propaganda weapon.
I wonder if these terrorist sympathisers at the BBC would be so starry eyed about these killers if their own children were mudered at a sunday school?
I now wear the star of David around my neck and will continue to do so untill Israel triumphs.(a small gesture)
The BBC has excelled itself on this one. But what do you expect?
They have distanced themselves completely from the obvious association they should have with democratic Israel with its free speech, argumentative and diverse population, democratic government and any other values it shares with Britain, and unbelievably sentimantalised and cosied up to fanatical hate filled maniacs who use their own population as fodder in their propaganda war, the war that the BBC is aiding and abetting.
And I don’t mean I want bias towards Israel. Just restoration of sanity.
I should have just borrowed from the BBC’s headline
” Attack won’t halt talks, Sue says”
Further to my last post.
I urge all right minded people to wear the STAR OF DAVID on their person for the duration of Israels brave struggle with base evil.
I further urge people to write to the Israeli embassy to show their support.
WE ARE ALL ISRAELIS NOW!
Sue:
I should have just borrowed from the BBC’s headline
” Attack won’t halt talks, Sue says”
Sue | 07.03.08 – 8:01 am | #
Meant to post this on the other thread – also, for “says” read “insists”
Hope you know what I’m on about, something to do with fish. And scales.
That unspeakable bastard Bowen has been on TOADY trying his level best to justify the murder of children!
According to Bowen the murdered children brought in on themselves because they are Zionists and settlers and budding leaders of the future!
Hammas murders children both their own and Israelis.
Hammas will continue to target children for murder because Hammas are evil.
Hammas terrorists are NOT freedom fighters,rocketeers,millitants and activists! Hammas are mass murders,butchers,child abusers,women abusers and evil twisted racist biggots.
Originally it was called an “accident”. I have the screen capture but they’ve edited it now
Jeremy Sharon | 06.03.08 – 9:47 pm
“Incident” is an improvement on the original.
DB | 06.03.08 – 10:12 pm
I’ve noticed that many of the people who write the “interactive” blurbs at the bottom of articles like this one and who invite the public to comment on Have Your Say topics are not fully literate:
Are you in the area? Have you been affected by this accident or have you seen or heard anything?…
So I think the original use of the word “accident” was just a stupid mistake by someone in protected BBC employment who meant to write “incident” but confused the two words.
That said, there is no excuse for using the mildest possible term for the cold-blooded slaughter of civilians. If the sensitive little dears at the BBC can’t bring themselves to use the word “terror” they should just call it an “attack”.
Bowen’s latest appearance featuring the usual explanations of the ‘context’ this must be seen in ( the Yeshiva’s links with the settler movement, and the civilian deaths in Gaza) included a quote from a former student at the school, from England, no less.
This person, Jeremy’s new best friend, told Jeremy that he didn’t blame the Palestinians, but admired them. After all they were fighting for their land. No, he continued, I blame our leaders (proceeded to list them all) Then smugly, with a look that said “a man after my own heart.” Bowen signed off
Bryan,
Its a bit OT, but why don’t the Israeli govt try a bit harder to counter some of this propaganda ?
They need a twin-track approach:
1) Use the conventional MSM.
2) Newer methods like blogs, YouTube, etc.
Why not post films on YouTube showing what is really going on ?
Someone here mentioned the IDF watching as a 10-year old retrieved a weapon for a hamas terrorist. Why not film it and post it ?
“I now wear the star of David around my neck and will continue to do so untill Israel triumphs.(a small gesture)”
What constitutes an Israeli ‘triumph’ though? That’s the problem.
Bryan | 07.03.08 – 8:53 am
there is no excuse for using the mildest possible term for the cold-blooded slaughter of civilians. If the sensitive little dears at the BBC can’t bring themselves to use the word “terror” they should just call it an “attack”.
News 24 called it the ‘worst terrorist attack since……..’
Jack Hughes
there are videos on youtube. Like this one
I know what you mean though. It’s hard work though, e.g. have a look at this
http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediaselector/check/player/nol/newsid_7280000/newsid_7282400?redirect=7282458.stm&news=1&bbwm=1&bbram=1&nbwm=1&nbram=1&asb=1
Cockney: Israeli triumph for me would mean secure borders and peaceful coexistence with her neighbours. I’m not very sure about a Palestinian Arab state anymore, as the leaders of the Palestinian Arabs do not have my trust anymore.
Someone here mentioned the IDF watching as a 10-year old retrieved a weapon for a hamas terrorist. Why not film it and post it ?
Jack Hughes | 07.03.08 – 9:05 am
That’s a good point. The Israeli government is well-known for being lousy at PR. And a few weeks ago, believe it or not, I saw an ex-Israeli ambassador to the US say on TV that, “Kassam rockets had not yet killed anybody.” He was not challenged by the Israeli interviewer. A common attitude among people I’ve spoken to in Israel re lousy PR is to shrug their shoulders and say that no matter what Israel does, the Israel-haters will carry on regardless. While that is true, to let the propaganda stand is obviously to make it appear that there is no defence against it and that it is the truth.
News 24 called it the ‘worst terrorist attack since……..’
Anonymous | 07.03.08 – 10:23 am
Flash in the pan, I guess. I assume whoever let that through had their knuckles severely rapped.
What constitutes an Israeli ‘triumph’ though?
Cockney | 07.03.08 – 9:55 am
Peace.
All but one of the youths killed yesterday were between fifteen and nineteen years old.
If our Arab enemies can finally start to acquaint themselves with civilization, that will certainly be an Israeli triumph. But Israel can’t be expected to negotiate under terrorist fire. Who would?
“All but one of the youths killed yesterday were between fifteen and nineteen years old.”
Jeremy Bowen had them as ‘in their twenties’ on news 24. To avoid calling them ‘children?’
That’s what they call all Palestinian teenagers.
The BBC, the difference between Jewish and Islamic children and half a story.
The otherday the BBC reported on the accidental deaths of 4 children in Gaza.
Four children die in Gaza strike
Four Palestinian children have been killed in an Israeli air strike in the northern Gaza Strip, local medics say.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7269154.stm
and here is how they report on the deaths of 8 children in Jerusalem who were targeted by a terrorist.
Mourners gather at Israeli school
Thousands of people have gathered at a Jewish religious college in Jerusalem where a gunman killed eight people and injured nine on Thursday evening…The eight people killed were all under 30 years of age, many of them just teenagers...The BBC’s Middle East editor Jeremy Bowen says that the school was no ordinary seminary. It was the ideological cradle of the settler movement in the West Bank, which could be the reason it was targeted.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7282948.stm
So the BBC while more than happy to scream “Jews kill Children “ from the tops of the highest minarets when they get caught up in the fighting that has plagued the region for over 15000 years goes down to the deepest cellar in which to squeak that people have died in an premeditated attack on a school. But just in case you didn’t know the BBC informs you that the gunman had a right to slot those so called people because it was the home of the Jewish national front.
By the way here is a little info on the first of the two victims to be buried;
The funeral processions of the two of the yeshiva students killed in Thursday’s terror attack in Jerusalem have arrived at the Mount of Olives graveyard. The two casualties, 15-year-old Neria Cohen of Jerusalem and 15-year-old Segev Peniel Avihail of Neveh Daniel, will be laid to rest at the cemetery. (Aviram Zino)
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3516209,00.html
The BBC, the difference between Jewish and Islamic children and half a story.
I had them as being aged 15 plus. To tell you the truth I went straight to the JP website, I did not bother with the BBC.
As for the BBC I suppose they called it an accident because the terrorist was unable to kill more.
To the Westerner who ‘understands’ the terrorist
Jeremy Bowen had them as ‘in their twenties’ on news 24. To avoid calling them ‘children?’
That’s what they call all Palestinian teenagers.
Sue | 07.03.08 – 11:40 am
Bowen is either deliberately lying or misinformed. As for the victims being under 30, from pounce’s post, that sounds like deliberate propaganda. These were youths, most of them of school-going age.
Just watched Newsnight. I was amazed to hear last night’s incident being described as a terrorist attack.
The BBC using the T-word?
Stephen Pollard’s not impressed with Bowen:
“Jeremy Bowen comment in a BBC report of yesterday’s murders in the Jerusalem yeshiva is about as close to an excuse and justification as I’ve ever seen…”
http://www.spectator.co.uk/stephenpollard/544851/bowens-at-it-again.thtml
Futher to my last, here are the names and ages of the victims of last nights accident;
Yohai Lifshitz, 18, of Jerusalem
Yehonatan Yitzhak Alder, 16, of Shilo
Yehonadav Haim Hirshfeld, 19, of Kochav Hashahar
Neria Cohen, 15, of Jerusalem
Roy Rot, 18, of Elkana
Segev Peniel Avihail, 15, of Neveh Daniel
Avraham David Mozes, 16, of Efrat
Doron Mahareta, 26, of Ashdod
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3516126,00.html
The beeb were quite prompt in removing the Have Your Say subject from its pages. Wonder if the responses didn’t meet its pre-set expectations? You can picture now the six or so right-on leftist doctering the messages that go out.
Hang on, when Israel moves into Palestinian territory and kills innocent people, you complain that there isn’t enough context, that the fact that there wasn’t enough context and that the BBC doesn’t point out how many Palestinians voted for Hamas and thus had it coming.
But when the BBC speculates as to this nutter’s motives, and in fairly mild terms:
“The fact that the school is at the heart of the settler movement in the occupied West Bank may have been the reason why it was targeted, BBC Middle East editor Jeremy Bowen reports.”
You complain of the exact opposite.
Which do you want? Ideological context or no ideological context? Or is it, as I suspect, one for your enemies and the other for your friends?
“The beeb were quite prompt in removing the Have Your Say subject from its pages. Wonder if the responses didn’t meet its pre-set expectations?”
Have you ever even read HYS? If the BBC took down every threat where right-wing consensus prevailed, they would take down the entire site.
Jeremy Bowen was skating on thin ice, in a normal sane world a complaint about him justifying terrorism, for that sick justification of the murder of teenagers would stick, but not here, not in Britain. Makes me sick in the stomach that he can sit there sprouting out justification for hate with impunity.
If the BBC took down every threat where right-wing consensus prevailed, they would take down the entire site.
Angry Young Alex | Homepage | 07.03.08 – 2:16 pm |
Yup 😉
I’m not even sure that there’s a typo here.
But when the BBC speculates as to this nutter’s motives, and in fairly mild terms:
“The fact that the school is at the heart of the settler movement in the occupied West Bank may have been the reason why it was targeted, BBC Middle East editor Jeremy Bowen reports.”
Angry Young Alex | Homepage | 07.03.08 – 2:16 pm
And the motive’s for: ❓
4 Feb 2008: One dies, Dimona suicide bombing
29 Apr 2007: Three die, Eilat suicide bombing
17 Apr 2006: Nine die, 40 wounded, suicide bombing near old bus station in Tel Aviv
30 Mar 2006: Four die, Kedumim suicide bombing
29 Dec 2005: Thee die, suicide bombing near Tulkarm
5 Dec 2005: Five die, Netanya suicide bombing
26 Oct 2005: Six die, Hadera market suicide bombing
12 July 2005: Two die, Netanya suicide bombing
25 Feb 2005: Five die, 50 hurt, suicide bombing outside Tel Aviv nightclub
13 Jan 2005: Six die, suicide bombing at Karni crossing
Check out the Hamas charter for a likely motive.
the Islamic Resistance Movement aspires to the realisation of Allah’s promise, no matter how long that should take. The Prophet, Allah bless him and grant him salvation, has said:
“The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews.” (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).