I’m sure you will be aware that Dutch politician Geert Wilders has posted a film critical of the Koran on the internet. The opening scenes show a copy of the Koran, followed by footage of the attacks on the US on 11 September 2001. The 17-minute film was posted on video-sharing website LiveLeak. (It’s been posted over on my own blog as it all helps the general debate on the Religion of Peace AND Love.)
Now then, the BBC reports this but the BBC report itself is laced with all kinds of subtle poison. For example, if you read it you will note that the State Broadcaster cannot apparently find anyone to interview who is in FAVOUR of this film on the nature of Islam. Furthermore it immediately characterises Geert Wilders as “right-wing” however no other political comment is prefaced with such a description. Is anyone who opposes the advance of Islam a right-winger?
Now I don’t hold the BBC responsible for the cowardly Dutch PM Jan Peter Balkenende who disowns this questioning of Islam, but I do hold the BBC responsible for ensuring that the topic is covered by providing a range of views. However anyone who raises questions about the Koran and those who use it to justify their terrorist pathologies seems to be persona non gratia in Beebland.
P you disingenuous little chip, Can you see a party of Muslim children making the sign of the cross in a Catholic Church? All hell would break loose, and you know it.
Arrange such a visit and you might be viewed other than a propagandist.
“”Alex, what is your academic background?”
Modern Languages, what’s yours?
Alex | Homepage | 31.03.08 – 11:46 am | # ”
Missed English did you?
Allan@Norway:
Imagine if there were no PC: islam would make no headway in the west because islam would not be allowed entry into the west.
Hadn’t realised it was that simple, but my eyes are now wide open…..
A few questions:
1. Why limit it to Muslims? Let’s keep out all the other undesirables – Mormons, Moonies, Scientologists, Jehova’s Doorknockers, Catholics, those agressive Buddhist monks, atheists (+ insert name here).
2. If there were no PC, Bill Gates might be unhappy (though I prefer Macs).
3. You’d have to allow much bigger police budgets. No PC means you’d have to pay them all at Sergeants’ rates.
.
“The ring leader of the 7/7 bombers Mohammed Siddque Khan was age 31 when he died. He was married with 1 child and had another on the way. He was university educated. Out of the 4 7/7 bombers 2 of them were teenagers, the others were fully grown adults. To call them kids is, at the very best, glib. At worst it is base and evasive.”
One of them was a West Indian married to an English girl,they had both converted to Islam.
“2. If there were no PC, Bill Gates might be unhappy (though I prefer Macs).”
Ah yes! The flashers first choice.
“No, it’s a response to someone who sees a visit by schoolchildren to a place of worship – without any accompanying evidence – as something highly sinister, and suspect.”
I went on a school trip to a Mosque and I was not asked to pray. These school children were being asked to practice a religion.. Geddit yet?
“For better or worse, Islam is part of the status quo, unless there are plans to eject the x million muslims currently living in the UK, or forcibly convert them to another religion, or shut down all mosques. Are you suggesting any of those options is either feasible or desirable?”
If not now, when? Never, in your case. Which means you support Islamification.
Islam is wicked and vicious, moreover the Arabic language has no word for “democracy” or “libertarian.”
“Well I don’t actually, because “normalising” Islam, could mean anything, depending on whether you’re simply libertarian – these people should be free to worship what they choose – or a full blown moonbat who thinks a parallel sharia legal system is A-OK.”
Don’t you think prohibiting Sharia is an aggressive imposition on the liberty of Muslims?
“I went on a school trip to a Mosque and I was not asked to pray. These school children were being asked to practice a religion.. Geddit yet?”
If you think those children were “practising” religion, you’re even more of a looney than I thought. Ever removed your shoes when you’ve gone to a buddhist temple? Were you practising buddhism?
“If not now, when? Never, in your case. Which means you support Islamification.”
Correct. I don’t support ejecting all muslims, closing down all mosques or forcing all muslims to convert. If you think that means de facto support for Islamification you need to get out more.
“Don’t you think prohibiting Sharia is an aggressive imposition on the liberty of Muslims?”
No. Next question?
“+ insert name here”
OK I will…
“hillhunt”
1. Why limit it to Muslims? Let’s keep out all the other undesirables – Mormons, Moonies, Scientologists, Jehova’s Doorknockers, Catholics, those agressive Buddhist monks, atheists (+ insert name here).
Undesirables? Where are gangs of mormons running around forcing white girls into prostitution, Scientologist suicide-bombers, Jehovah’s jihadists etc.
Hillhunt provides all the arguments to refute his own.
1-0. Easy win
“I’m assuming German and French, Alex, but it’s irrelevant. What does matter is why you think that your background gives you some advantage over other contributors who post clear examples of BBC bias. I have not seen you demolish any of them.”
Mate právdu, e jsem studoval francouský a německý. But at what point did I claim my background gave me any advantage over other posters?
“Islam is wicked and vicious, moreover the Arabic language has no word for “democracy” or “libertarian.””
“ديمقراطية”, “deemuqratia” means “democracy”. I just looked it up on wikipedia and clicked the Arabic language cross-link (العربية).
Now Arabic wikipedia didn’t have an entry on Libertarianism, but it did have “لاسلطوي”, meaning ‘anarchy’, and even if they didn’t have a word for Libertarianism they could just build one from the “ح-ر-ر”, “h-r-r” root meaning freedom.
Unfortunately Alex, my only knowledge of eastern European languages comes from the little Russian that I know (true that I studied French and German??)
You believe that you are superior to other posters here, and your condescending attitude really p*sses me off because you have no reason to address people in such a manner – unless ad hominem attacks are your defensive reflex. That you have studied modern languages and not the ludicrous media studies does in fact indicate that you are better educated than I had supposed from your posts.
It is my experience that people with your attitude to others consider themselves to have better background, be it education, wealth, or just a generally unfounded uppitiness.
So Alex, which other modern languages?
Chippy.
“If you think those children were “practising” religion, you’re even more of a looney than I thought. Ever removed your shoes when you’ve gone to a buddhist temple? Were you practising buddhism?”
Still haven’t got to terms with Muslims genuflecting in a church have you.Come on, give us an example of members the ROP making the sign of the cross. In Riyadh Cathedral perhaps.
What about the Sunday School trip to Mecca?
islam has no place in western democratic culture, it is a divide and conquer non integrating religion, fortunately still in its infancy in the west, so we may still have time to remove it, i kid you not if we dont take an aggressive stance against this religion of hate we will be watching our grandchildren going to school veiled, hanging homosexuals and paying a dhimmi tax to our islamic masters, at the rate they are invading the country and multiplying ( at 3 times the indiginous population ) we are probably only 2 generations away from being a minority in our own once great country i for one want no part of that.
The BBC does report the political and judicial conflict in Turkey at present over the increasing Islamisation in that country. (In the BBC’s classification, and wishful thinking, ‘Turkey’ is in Europe, rather than in Asia, on the BBC news-site.):
“The case revives the battle between Turkey’s secularists and the AK Party of devout Muslims.”
‘Turkey leaders face court case’
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7321964.stm
The BBC report briefly mentions possible implications for Turkey’s application to join the E.U., but the BBC report does NOT mention the enthusiasm of Labour’s Gordon Brown and David Miliband for Turkish entry to the E.U., under the AKP, or whoever. Isn’t it the BBC’s job to make the links between political developments in Turkey and the attitude of the British government?
For more on ominous developments in Turkey:
‘ Shari’a Approaches in Turkey ‘
http://www.newenglishreview.org/blog_direct_link.cfm/blog_id/13806
“You believe that you are superior to other posters here, and your condescending attitude really p*sses me off because you have no reason to address people in such a manner – unless ad hominem attacks are your defensive reflex.”
Yewhat? My background in languages tells me you have confused subject and object. Now, I may have called Cassandra a “patronising shite” for this:
“you do not have to be an expert on the KORAN(note the spelling)” Cassandra | 28.03.08 – 8:31 pm |
but the traffic seems to have been predominantly the other way.
“Your head is so far up your liberal @rse it’s scary…Now then, have you ever lived in the real world, or do you hover between Planet Media and the smokey world of the Media Studies undergraduate?”
Phil H | 28.03.08 – 4:58 pm |
“Alex doesn’t really mean it. Any of it. He’s just honing his debating technique for some unknown future benefit. How could someone so argumentatively incontinent be sincere about so much?” Sue | 29.03.08 – 1:07 pm |
“Be under no illusion Alex, you are a ready made dhimmi” Cassandra | 29.03.08 – 3:29 pm |
“You really are a bigoted little bugger aren’t ya. Typical leftist idiot.” LogicalUS | 29.03.08 – 5:57 pm |
“Alex: You really are a prat…You really are an idiot.” Martin | 29.03.08 – 6:49 pm |
“Alex,you are scum.” Peter | 29.03.08 – 6:56 pm |
“Some contributors have suggested that Alex should not be engaged because of his stupidity and offensiveness.”Allan@Oslo | 30.03.08 – 4:56 pm |
“You are a tit Alex.” Peter | 30.03.08 – 7:26 pm |
“Alex, quite wasting these good peoples’ time.” Susan | 30.03.08 – 9:41 pm |
–chip | 31.03.08 – 4:33 pm
If you find the one hour thirty eight minutes too boring, just watch the last 30 minutes of What the west needs to know about Islam.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8105709395775858867
I imagine you will dismiss it as scaremongering but you should at least understand why we fear many Muslims are not simply ‘worshiping what they choose.’
If you have any influence at the BBC, I suggest you put an end to the ratings driven drivel that depicts us all as binge drinking immoral dishonest philistines who worship only pop music, superficiality, and celebrityhood.
Portraying our society as degenerate and worthless is doing far more to alienate ‘moderate’ Muslims and drive them into the hands of extremists than criticising the radical anti western attitude that their religion espouses. Bending over backwards to accommodate them is not the answer.
We should certainly deport extremists and hatemongers, but far from favouring deportation of millions of Muslims or converting them to another religion I would advocate that the media starts by offering something positive to aspire to, and if Muslims wish to live here perhaps they will choose to turn towards that instead of a medieval religion.
Surely there are still some more inspiring and worthy aspects of our culture and values than the media pours into our homes at present. Addressing this is an absolute necessity if we are to have any credibility or influence – over our own wayward outcasts as well as alienated Muslims.
‘You love life, we love death’ is a very peculiar motto for a British citizen don’t you think.
Sending primary schoolchildren to the mosque as though Islam is a benign religion is a kind of collective deception.
Surely Islam’s death policy for apostasy puts it beyond the pale in any modern civilised state. Or it should, if we had any real convictions about sticking up for western values.
The plan fact is Islam is in direct violation of the most basic of European human rights, and none of the great and good of the chattering classes seem to be the least bit bothered. Why?
Has the BBC ever done a program for example about the plight of those that wish to leave Islam, and the very real dangers they face in almost anywhere in the Islamic world? After all, I thought the BBC was meant to be hot for all that human rights stuff.
Apparently not if it tarnishes the BBC’s carefully cultivated shiny image of Islam.
A pertinent question for the BBC and Muslims everywhere:
“All right, where is the worldwide Muslim indignation over THIS film?”
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/020516.php
funny how aunty are only interested in human rights abuses when they are supposedly carried out by white europeans, aint heard too much criticism of the chinese for tibet, or closer to home the asians( muslims ) at the centre of sex traffic allegations in northern england,or the flooding of the country with heroin by pakistani / asian drugs barons, forced marriages and underage sex,and feral youth predominantly non indiginous murdering each other on street corners in all parts of our major cities with guns and knives, and dont forget the great TB scandal, eliminated from the country through treatment and innoculation, only to be imported from the third world or filthy eastern europe to blight the country once more, i had almost forgotten how gratefull we should be having been so enriched by multiculturalism
“The story is about the turkish constitutional court deciding whether to hear – or not to hear – a case. The case has been brought by the chief prosecutor. It would close down Turkey’s ruling AK party for anti-secular activities. The AK party wants the country’s institutions to become more islamic and less secular.
Jack Hughes | 31.03.08 – 4:15 am |”
Here.
Do you want to stop this from happening?
Is prayer in an Islamic manner practice of the religion of Islam?
This question reveals the centre of the problem which I call The Liberal Cognitive Deficit.
Liberals expect people to:
A. Practice the religion of Islam,
whilst,
B. Not acting in an Islamic manner, which would include reading the Sunnah and instituting Sharia law.
George R: There are loads of cartoons produced in places like Iran and The West Bank that spout hatred of Jews and westerners. You won’t get any response from the mincing liberals because they are apologists for it.
WoAD
The headline and the story have changed a lot. When I posted, the headline was:
Turkey court mulls party ban case
A bit nonsensical.
I don’t really have any strong views on this story – just baffled by the crap headline.
I am puzzled why the EU has any view on this story. It seems that some turks in a turkish court are following the turkish laws to rule on turkish affairs. Fine by me.
I didn’t make it clear sorry. But I was supplementing an earlier point
“Don’t you think prohibiting Sharia is an aggressive imposition on the liberty of Muslims?”
It seems in the case of the rapidly re-Islamizing Turkey, force of one description or another has to be employed to keep Islam at bay. I want to stop this whole thing from happening in Europe with a discriminatory immigration policy.
“Don’t you think prohibiting Sharia is an aggressive imposition on the liberty of Muslims?”
What exactly do you mean by ‘prohibiting’ Sharia? How exactly do you prohibit a legal system?
Alex, you are wasting peoples’ time here. You fancy yourself an expert on Islam but clearly don’t know the first thing about it. Study it for eight years like I did, then come back and talk to us.
“What exactly do you mean by ‘prohibiting’ Sharia? How exactly do you prohibit a legal system?”
You make it illegal.
Make what illegal exactly? Chopping people’s hands off is already against the law, and I’m buggered if I know how you’d ban the bits about not drinking alcohol and not paying or receiving interest.
Ban the punishments you dick.If a system is deprived of sanctions it is dead.
Aren’t most of them already illegal?
Of course you could try making them illegal under international law and ban Sharia worldwide, but you’ll notice torture is also illegal, and that hardly deters Iran or Saudi Arabia. Or lovely secular Turkey for that matter.
Sign the petition for Gert Wilders
http://www.petitiononline.com/wilders/petition.html
The fact Theo Van Gogh’s film has never seen the light of day in this country tells us something.
Terrorism works.
It’s not reported by the BBC so far, but Brigitte Bardot,(aged 73), is currently on trial in Paris, charged with ‘inciting racial hatred’ for criticising Islam (not a race), and certain Islamic practices. The following is a headline from ‘Brussels Journal’, not from the BBC:-
“Brigitte Bardot: Heroine of Free Speech”
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/3177