As the BBC continues to push the threat of the vast Christian right wing terror threat across Europe, it was interesting to also hear it also advance the other side of the coin on Today this morning. It seems that the correct response to the Oslo atrocity is to have MORE multiculturalism, MORE Immigration, more of the same dysfunctional elite left wing politics that had created the tensions that are manifest across many European countries. The BBC has been a champion of multiculturalism, it believes as a matter of faith that immigration is always a good thing, it sees Christianity as bad if not worse as Islam and this Oslo atrocity will now be used at proof that those who oppose the BBC’s views are akin to Brievik.
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It sends a shudder down my spine when I hear about some of these 14/15 year olds that were killed (RIP) and we are told, for example, that “He was a leading light in the youth wing of the Party and was tipped to be a leader of the country one day”
I can understand why Anders Breivik felt that his country was beyond democracy. Shouldn’t politicians prove their worth to the electorate in the real world, not just be groomed and chosen by the current leaders at weekend get-aways whilst they are still children?
This young man would not have become Prime Minister unless elected. I remember a certain 16 year old who spoke at the Tory Party conference in the 70’s tipped for the hightest office as well. All very elementary stuff.
What does bear examination are the alleged links of Norway’s Labour youth with Hamas and the criminal charges it filed against a speaker at the Opposition ‘Progress Party’ conference for addressing the problems of Islamisation in parts of Norway. Not the moment to do so, granted, but then the BBC are not a million miles away from this new age fascism, so there will never be a time to take a critical look at these serious strain of evil in Norwegian left-wing politics.
The analogy with Hague giving a speech to a Conservative Party Conference (which was unusual because of his age) and an organised summer camp for the young Party faithful is a poor one. Of course these summer camps are not Communist Pioneer or Hitler Youth camps, but to Anglo-Saxon eyes the very concept of Party summer camps for young people has repellant (not to say sinister) overtones. Then again Norway probably has a more collectivist mentality.
“ Since 1960, Camp Caesar has also been the site of Camp Lincoln, the annual youth camp of the West Virginia Republican Party. Camp Caesar is also used by many religious groups for their summer camps and is the home of the Webster County Fair, which is held the first week in September.”
http://www.wvencyclopedia.org/articles/821
Again a poor analogy. You seem to think that because “Camp Caesar” has “Republican” and “Youth Camp” in front of it that it is the same as the Norwegian example. The USA is a large country and has all sorts of different groups and activities. I very much doubt that American Republican Party has a central youth summer camp where the children of Party members (who are talent spotted as future leaders) are addressed by the Party Leaders. If they were to have such a thing, it would be equally repellent.
For the liberal left, grooming/indoctrinating the young is a priority, My Site. Common Purpose has its beady eye on our malleable youth, & runs courses for suitable young candidates. No doubt teachers who have ‘successfully’ attended CP courses act as talent spotters.
‘What is Your Turn?
A leadership course for young people. Your Turn challenges young people to think in new ways (CP’s ways? Stringently PC) about the place where they live & the world around them, to examine how decisions are made & see how they can make change happen…In England, YT complements the national curriculum ( already dumbed down, one world, revisionist, utopian bunkum), the Citizenship (how to be a good little Brave New Worlder) & PHSE (Personal, Social & Health Education, primarily concerned with value systems, attitudes & behaviour) syllabuses.’
Social engineering? A production line of Manchurian candidates? And Common Purpose has charity status. Jesus.
It’s funny, every time we get an atrocity carried out by terrorists in the name of Islam, the BBC will immediately air programmes to show just how peaceful the religion of Islam is – with the implication being that it’s only a few ‘nutters’ who spoil it for everyone else.
Will the BBC, I wonder, do the same for this atrocity?
I shall not hold my breath…….
The BBC are only spouting what Eurovision tell them.
Like the Eurozone fiasco…it`s failing because YOU lot are not as committed and psssionate as we are.
Give up all independence and rights to vote on any of it-and then we`ll be fine!
Typical then that the BBC WOULD advocate more deliquescence into the cat litter of Strasbourg, New York…anywhere where the surrender isn`t filmed(Lisbon) and the food and weather are nice(Kyoto).
“Waist Deep in the Big Muddy” indeed-listen and learn…Dick Gaughans version is my favourite!
The bBC never mentions the inconvient fact that the Lords report of about 2-3 years ago, showed the economic effects of immigration on %gdp per person was neutral. When you took into consideration the effect on resourses it was negative.
The perceptive Peter Hitchens nots that the Norwegian murderer was actually citing his steroids and antidepressant cocktail as being part of his regime just prior to his atrocities.
Seems to me then, that anti-depressants and anabolic steroids need removing and persecution far more that John Stuart Mill, anti EU, pro US/Israel and Christian conservatives do.
Still-because its the BBC-and their drugs and Olympian wish to stay in the 24/7 gabble marathon of their own devising-I think it safe to say that the use of anabolic steroids with anti-depressants willNOT be cited,let alone investigated…of it is was, they`d get David Nutt or Steve Jones to look into it!
That’s the first I’ve heard of anti-depressant and steroid abuse! But of course the media would rather blame Chrisitanity and conservativism wouldn’t they. We had the same thing with Jared Loughner (the nutcase who shot the congresswoman). Attempts to paint him as a ‘Right Extremist’ were eventually derailed by his own schizophrenic ramblings.
Tommy Robinson Cleans the BBC’s Clock
The question the bBC should really be asking is:
“Are the Public really that stupid to swallow all this Islam is a relgion of peace crap we peddle out”
Maybe there lies the reason why people are gravating to the right.
Wild
“very concept of Party summer camps for young people has repellant (not to say sinister) overtones. “
I was simply pointing out that holding political summer camps is something that is practiced by a lot of parties both left and right. Both main parties in the US have summer camps. The BNP held one here in the UK. All the main parties have youth wings as well as student wings.
I am not sure there is anything particularly unusual in the Norway.
And surely the quote about “He was a leading light in the youth wing of the Party and was tipped to be a leader of the country one day”
Was said of the young William Hague?
I am not sure why you seem to think that “The BNP held one here in the UK” is enough to reassure anybody that Youth Summer Camps for Party Members does not have totalitarian overtones.
There is a big difference between student union politics (no matter how infantile) and summer camps for the children of Party members.
I cannot recall anybody describing William Hague as a “leading light in the youth wing of his Party” the whole concept is alien to Conservative politics.
What you have is individuals with views, who join, or organize themselves into, groups, that allow people a platform for skills that may or may not help them if the decide to pursue a career in politics.
especially summer youth camps where hatred of israel is drilled into the young impressionable minds of those who don’t know better
You seem to be suggesting that there was something odd or strange about this. “the very concept of Party summer camps for young people has repellant (not to say sinister) overtones.” But such camps take place in the UK and the US.
As Hippiepooter pointed out there is no suggestion that they would be appointing leaders.
My understanding of the AUFis that it is very much like Conservative Future or Young Labour. Now I could be completely wrong – I am not an expert and don’t speak a word of Norwegian, but that is what I gleaned from their site
<img style=”width: 45px; height: 45px; margin-top: 1.5px; margin-left: 1.5px;” src=”http://js-kit.com/avatar/daf9fe86920c214fdb4ef7256911b062.png”/>
Frode Berge, leader of the Labour Party in the region of Rogaland, Norway, writes about the importance of the party’s summer camp held by his party every year on Utoeya island
“Utoeya offers the perfect surroundings for teenagers who are seeking to combine their affection for politics with the classic activities of the traditional summer camp…The Labour Party has been a dominant political force in Norway for the last 60-70 years, and the AUF has been an extremely important base for recruiting and training our political leaders. Utoeya has served as the main national platform for this recruiting and training. Every summer, some 700-1,000 Labour youths from all over Norway gather for political debate and seminars covering topics like international solidarity, environmental issues, education, vocational training, and how to fight racism and xenophobia….The AUF summer camp at Utoeya is the place our party leader and other prominent leaders always simply have to attend….Summer camps at Utoeya generate massive media coverage, and regularly set the national political agenda…The losses at Utoeya are greater than any of us can bear alone, and the response from the AUF is based on the best of our values of solidarity: we will live through this together.”
Note that he frames everything in terms of Party solidarity. When the IRA bombed the Conservative Party Conference I am pretty sure Maggie did not say “The Party will prevail” I put money on it that said something along the lines “Our free society will survive” or “Civilised values will prevail”.
“Conservative Future” as I understand it is for anybody who is a member of the Conservative Party under 30. I very much doubt if they have seminars for teenagers which seek to instruct them in correct political thinking, with rewards for approprate Party spirit.
I have slightly lost track of your point.
Are you saying there is something wrong in groups of young people who share the same political values getting together? There is nothing unique about Norway in this regard.
Are you suggesting there is something wrong, or untoward about this?
And in his statement I don’t think he isn’t talking about party solidarity, “we will live through this together” is talking about everyone, not talking about the party.
Geoff Watts,
Are you deliberately trying to be obtuse?
To answer your questions.
It is not young people spontaneously forming political discussion groups, it is a political party recruiting children for its own ends. The fact that you cannot spot the difference between this and say a political club at a university does not mean there is no relevant difference.
Frode Berge clearly is talking about the solidarity of the PARTY. Just because you do not comprehend his meaning does not mean that his meaning is not clear.
By the way I never said that the “We the Party” mentality is unique to Norwegian Leftists.
The point I am making is that these conferences are not unique to Norway. No one is suggesting that it was a spontaneous gathering, only you. You also seem to suggest that there is something sinister about this. The only reason it is sinister to you is that you don’t know of any others. I have shown that there are plenty of other examples.
Haing done a bit more research – I found a Tea Party camp for children aged 8-12
“The organization, which falls under the tea party umbrella, hopes to introduce kids ages 8 to 12 to principles that include “America is good,” “I believe in God,” and “I work hard for what I have and I will share it with who I want to. Government cannot force me to be charitable.”
Organized by conservative writer Jeff Lukens and staffed by volunteers from the 912 Project, Tampa Liberty School will meet every morning July 11-15 in borrowed space at the Paideia Christian school in Temple Terrace.
“We want to impart to our children what our nation is about, and what they may or may not be told,” Lukens said.
There is something rather unsettling about your line of argument. it is almost as if you are suggesting there is something wrong with what these youths did – which is not far from trying to assign guilt to them.
However, the only point I am trying to get you to see is that there is nothing unusual in this arrangement – even for Anglo Saxons. I provided plenty of evidence to substantiate my claim. If you chose not to understand it then I have done all I can.
the tea party is not a political party in and of itself
Again Geoff Watts, are you being deliberately obtuse? I never said that it was only Norway that had political instruction camps for children.
It was precisely the contrast between adults forming political groups for themselves and Party directed children’s camps that I was noting.
I do not find it sinister because I know of no others, the political indoctrination of children is a commonplace. How many times do I have to repeat the same point.
You pick out a youth group which meets at Tampa Liberty School each morning July 11-15 in borrowed space at the Paideia Christian school in Temple Terrace. This is obviously a local group organised by some local volunteers with a view to promote concepts such as “God exists” “America is Good” and “Hard work ought to be rewarded”. This sounds pretty much like an American version of the Cubs and Boy Scouts (which some on the Left hate so much they have formed an alternative called the “Woodcraft Folk” – which presumably instructs children to say that God does not exist, your country stinks, and always work on the principle that somebody else should pay-) but the point remains EXACTLY the same. IF these groups were to became party political indoctrination summer camps for children I would find them just as distasteful.
As for your point about me blaming the children, I think you plucked that one out of thin air. It is pretty obvious my target is abuse of power by adults.
“It seems that the correct response to the Oslo atrocity is to have MORE multiculturalism, MORE Immigration …”
I suspect that sometime in the future, any opposition to this diabolically failed policy will find the BBC opining simplistically that such views could lead to ‘another Oslo’.
The multiculturalism and importation of third-world Muslims will continue until morale improves.
wild
In this country the various political parties have conferences – and so do some of their “youth wings”.
But “youth wing” does not mean kids of 16 and 17.
Like you, I don’t like the idea of indoctrinating kids in their mid-teens – especially if done by a party with quasi-monopoly power for many decades.
Of course in the UK there is plenty of indoctrination of impressionable youth already – the BBC, get them young, warp their minds, fill their heads with PC nonsense.
Oh heck!
The mafia of Naples are now being upbraided by the BBC…not for anything silly like murder and corruption mind…but for fly tipping.
True that some of it is toxic waste-but no licenses?…no recycling policy/…I bet their hit fleet aren`t even electric or green!
Disgraceful…I for one will be giving the Camorra REAL bad body language when next I order a pizza.
I suggest you do the same-sends signal you see!
Regarding the Fantasy Island idea of the political elite and their summer camps…I can see the BBC blagging that floating man-made island in Albert Dock, Liverpool. If they tow it down the Ship Canal now-it`ll be by the Lowry for Christmas.
Let the new breed of Beeboids flourish in the Salford hothouse!…tomorrow belongs to these desert orchids…who am I to tell them no?
As Bill O’Reilly says – the Norwegian nutter is NOT a Christian :
http://bigpeace.com/abostom/2011/07/26/bill-oreilly-debunks-the-christian-terrorist-canard-regarding-norwegian-mass-murderer-brevik/
Whereas Jihadists committing thousands of attacks worldwide ARE Muslim
O’Reilly’s points are mostly correct, this guy doesn’t appear to have actually been a practicing Christian in any real sense. It is telling the evidence used from his writings is mostly about cultural Christianity, which in this context, where he might as well state his beliefs outright, seems to suggest he didn’t put much trust in the transcendental and spiritual side of Christianity.
However when Bill says he can’t be a Christian because he killed people, then you’re in murky waters. Many Muslims say the same about Muslim terrorists, many socialists say the same about the Soviet Union(or at least that it wasn’t real socialism.). It takes a lot of detailed argument and detailed comparison to pull off such an argument and it is still open whether Christian beliefs had something to do with his general mindset.
The best response in such situations is simply to reiterate that such acts are anti-Christian and that it is silly to suggest that what this one man does tarnishes all Christians unless one can back it with serious and detailed argument. This though we should recognise is also how we Christians and conservatives should approach Muslims, socialists and so forth.
It is for God to decide whether this Norwegian murderer is Christian or not. I say he`s not-but it`s not my judgement ,but His that counts.
But not to the secular media-they reckon his crimes merit only21 years in (no doubt) a humane regime of psychobabble and meds until he is deemed safe again.
Think I`ll stick with Gods judgements and not the EUs takeaway toolbox of pastel paints and CBT. Safer!
Jesus by the way has already decided the blokes sentence(Lk 17.2;Mk9.42 etc) so the liberal media can continue to be exactly in the games that O`Reilly states