Here you go, a brand new Open Thread to see us all off into the weekend. Detail the bias here please!
WEEKEND OPEN THREAD…..
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Further to the Jo Cox case and the vast right wing conspiracy. I now read that the .22 rifle Mair used was stolen from its legal owner last year.
The police do not know who stole it, and have now launched an investigation, a little late in the day, in my opinion.
They have established that they do not think Mair shortened the rifle himself.
So we have a man with no friends, no social life, no private computer, yet somehow he has made contact with someone who has supplied him with an illegal firearm, an unusual piece which I have never heard of a criminal using. He used the gun to kill an MP at just the time when the Brexit campaign would suffer the most damage from his action.
The MSM seem to think there is some sort of shadowy right wing group at large here. I doubt it. I would expect the police to know of any such nutters on their patch, and especially keep an ear to the ground with regard to illegal arms procurement. Yet it seems they have nothing.
Mair was a very quiet man, who had mental health issues, but who had never been in any sort of trouble with the police, and was not a member of any far right groups. The police obviously cannot connect him to any such group.
Throughout history, there have been cases of assassinations or similar acts which serve the ruling elite, and which are always blamed on socially inadequate loners. I can point to the murder of Kirov, the Reichstag fire, the murder of Trotsky, the assassinations of President Kennedy, Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King. In every case, the perpetrator was portrayed as a lone nut, though at least in the murder of Trotsky, we now know it was an NKVD hit job.
There are many vulnerable, lonely people who are easy for skilled operators to manipulate. Put the ideas into their heads, convince them that they are special, give them a gun and the rest is history.
I can only ask a question which Lenin also raised: “Who, whom?”, by which he meant who benefits, at the expense of whom?
If you ask that question of the Jo Cox murder then beware, because you are starting to think for yourself. That is frowned on in today’s Britain.
So if Brexit hadn’t occurred and we weren’t such evil people, he might have contented himself with collecting stamps and rescuing kittens?
Really? He’s not the first violent loon, and even fools should know, he won’t be the last.
“Really? He’s not the first violent loon, and even fools should know, he won’t be the last.”
I think you are making a mistake there. Mair had never been violent in his life, nor was he a lunatic. He apparently had OCD and some other mental health issues. He wasn’t a psychopath or a violent man.
He had no friends, no political connections, had no history of political activity. So where did he get this gun from, and why did he decide to kill an MP at the time most perfectly calculated to damage the Brexit campaign?
I can’t answer these questions, only ask them. All I can say if that Mair seems to fit into the pattern of a loner, socially isolated, who suddenly decides to commit a political assassination. Did this idea just come to him, or was he somehow manipulated into doing it, and if so, by whom? These are the really important questions in this case, and the MSM is not asking them.
I did ask at the time – was he just set up like Oswald?
In both cases – we will never know.
It is worth inquiring and not trusting the media. People are asking questions.
First question – who benefits?
“Who benefits?”
Are we going for endless conspiracy theories as with Kennedy – I really hope not. Most unlikely we’ll ever know – move on.
” cowardly attack ” . Funny. Muslim terrorist attacks are never described as “cowardly “. But we all know which side the BBC are on !!
Indeed. The BBC having Mr. Mair’s murderous assault described as ‘daring’ or ‘audacious’ may trigger those happier with such terms applied elsewhere.
Mishal may be keepin score.
gaxvil,
My sincere apologies. It is now an intellectual crime to speculate, to consider plausible explanations.
Best stick to the BBC version. We will never know.
So why don’t you just move on with your authoritarian streak. Thanks for an insight into your boundless knowledge
Question for y,all. What would we do without the BBC automatons to tell us what to think ?
G.W.F. and any others I have deeply offended,
You think there is something to be gained by assisting the BBC et al in keeping the Cox murder going?
You think posting here will expose the Mair/Cox conspiracy?
I don’t think so.
And as for my, “authoritarian streak” – By God this country is crying out for, authority. Head, heart and backbone all seem sadly lacking.
I reckon we all know the BBC wouldn’t know the truth if it flew up their blow holes and whistled Dixie. Next question?
.22 as the calibre of choice? Who knows?
Guest,
.303 to be sure
Gaxvil:
“I did ask at the time – was he just set up like Oswald?”
Exactly so, my thoughts too.
The amazing aspect to the Kennedy assassination was the very restrained reaction from the US when a Soviet agent shoots the American President.
Framer:
There may be a good reason for that, if Lee Harvey Oswald was not a Soviet agent.
” These are the really important questions in this case, and the MSM is not asking them.”
RiC, any journalist who asked them would be out of a job by 5pm the same day. In other posts you’ve pointed out that the Dunblane files are sealed for more than a generation. There are questions that it’s dangerous to ask. Journalists might be mendacious, but they’re not stupid.
And important questions to be answered over the death of, Lee Rigby – still waiting.
RJ:
Yes, I fear you are right, the MSM will not touch this with a barge pole.
gaxvil
Is ‘violent loon’ your diagnosis? The court did not pronounce on his sanity; he was found guilty of murder. Do you have evidence not submitted to the trial?
G.W.F.,
Looks like handbags at dawn then?
There will be a book in it for a writer/journalist brave enough to investigate.
Meanwhile some people are happy to be adamant that they know Mair was a ‘Brexiteer’ despite the fact he would not have had the opportunity to vote:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38089711#comment_125849266
@Up2snuff you’ll have to tell us what specific comment you were linking to …cos that link doesn’t bring it up
Stew, sorry about that. Go to the ‘Latest comments first’ and you will see me debating with a poster called Hadrian, a few pages back from the end.
He is typical of Mair=Brexiteer therefore Brexiteers=Mair=Nazis mind-set.
Good writing Rob. It is beyond bizarre . You just couldn’t make this stuff up. They actually sacrificed one of their own loons for the cause and still lost.
Agree, Lock, Rob is bold & brave to ask the questions to find truth and anchor it in history. For now, we probably have to let Jo Cox rest in peace and try to preserve our democracy.
It will be a great shame upon anyone who seeks to make political capital for the Remain cause or their own political group and Remain (Blair? Campbell?) from her killing. They should be held in contempt.
Thanks Lock.
If you had had to pick a Remain MP to be a martyr for the cause, you could not have done better than Jo Cox, an attractive young mother of two small children. A fat, middle aged ex union official would not be such a sympathetic figure would he?
I thought on that day that the Brexit campaign, which had been gaining momentum up to that point, had been derailed. Luckily it had not been, but I think the result was closer than it might have been been, and thus allows the Remoaners to continue their Establishment campaign for a second referendum.
If Britain leaves the EU, it may well be the beginning of the end for that organisation. It is a gravy train worth billions to its insiders. They will do anything to thwart Brexit. Conversely, why would a man whom everyone agrees was intelligent, decide that this was just the time to murder an MP whilst allegedly shouting “Britain First”?
Why would someone who committed such a political murder then keep quiet in court, never opening his mouth to explain his political crime? If you were going to murder someone for the sake of your politics, wouldn’t you wish to air your case in the only forum you would ever get?
None of this makes any sense to me. I only hope that one day we find out more of what really happened.
“A fat, middle aged ex union official would not be such a sympathetic figure would he?”
Give the BBC credit though Rob, when Bob Crow died they were almost in tears.
Sorry, I forgot about him!
So in five years time when the Brexit arrangements are still bouncing back and forth between the Commons and Lords and Ring Wraiths scour the country searching for the one true keeper of the Article 50 ……………….
Lefties : Scared by Brexit, by Trump ?
Don’t worry, if you have enough MONEY can live safely
…………. in the new Islington Bubbledworld development
SNL comedy (why didn’t they try examining the Left before the US election ?)
Are there any rotting half cows at the periphery? Or butterflies?
Here is the tripe the bbc gave me when i complained that one of their articles was misleading in that it accused trump of being against migrants in general, when instead, as i was pointing out, he wants to target illegals and therefore criminals, which is only fair because the law is the law.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-37969112
We’ve reviewed the article and the headline currently reads as follows:
“Trump election: Up to three million migrants ‘to be targeted’”
We are conscious of the need for headlines to be worded carefully so as not to mislead readers or give the wrong impression about a story and it would be difficult for the BBC to headline that there are 3 million migrants with criminal records as we wouldn’t know this and Donald Trump didn’t state that this was the official number either. Wording headlines is frequently a very difficult decision for our editors and we appreciate that not all readers will feel we get it right on every occasion.
Headlines are short summaries of what can often be extremely detailed stories and it is simply not always possible to sum up all the various aspects of a story such as this within the space of a single headline.
The article itself can allow more detail to be carried and it states the following:
“Those targeted would be migrants with criminal records, such as gang members and drug dealers, he told US broadcaster CBS in an interview. There were an estimated 178,000 illegal immigrants with criminal records in the US in 2010, according to a congressional report.”
Then Donald Trump goes onto state the following:
“What we are going to do is get the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers, where a lot of these people, probably two million, it could be even three million, we are getting them out of our country or we are going to incarcerate.”
We hope that our concise headline can cover the context of both of Mr Trump’s comments. I can only assure you that BBC News doesn’t have any personal views on Mr Trump, nor do we believe there had been anything in our coverage that would indicate that we have.
We hope this is helpful in allaying your concerns and we’ve noted your suggestion of a story you felt should’ve been covered. Thank you again for this feedback.
Please know complaints are sent to senior management and news teams every morning and we’ve included your points in our overnight reports. These reports are among the most widely read sources of feedback in the BBC and ensure that complaints are seen quickly by the right people.
Kind regards
Philip Young
BBC Complaints Team
BBC News doesn’t have any personal views on Mr Trump?
They must be on acid.
That really is quite special of CECUTT, if in an evil Ralph Wiggum sense
Mata
“Headlines are short summaries of what can often be extremely detailed stories and it is simply not always possible to sum up all the various aspects of a story such as this within the space of a single headline.”
I will have a go for them. How about ‘Donald Trump’s position on migration’
Amongst all the glowing tributes to Castro from the likes of Corbyn, Juncker and Trudeau it looks like it has fallen on Donald Trump to tell it like it is –
“Today, the world marks the passing of a brutal dictator who oppressed his own people for nearly six decades. Fidel Castro’s legacy is one of firing squads, theft, unimaginable suffering, poverty and the denial of fundamental human rights. While Cuba remains a totalitarian island, it is my hope that today marks a move away from the horrors endured for too long, and toward a future in which the wonderful Cuban people finally live in the freedom they so richly deserve.
Though the tragedies, deaths and pain caused by Fidel Castro cannot be erased, our administration will do all it can to ensure the Cuban people can finally begin their journey toward prosperity and liberty. I join the many Cuban Americans who supported me so greatly in the presidential campaign, including the Brigade 2506 Veterans Association that endorsed me, with the hope of one day soon seeing a free Cuba.”
President-elect Donald J Trump
I bet the BBC love Trump even more now ……
On social media, I have noticed some surprising voices granting grudging acknowledgement that he has it right and clear versus the insulting waffle of such Titans of Statespesonship as Obama, Corbyn and Juncker
As an update, Breitbart is reporting that Obama has sent his condolences.
Lovely.
http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/11/26/obama-offers-condolences-fidel-castro-death/
Not the BBC, but given their predilection for inviting ‘contributions’, it so easily could be…
http://heatst.com/culture-wars/popular-youtuber-tricks-mic-journalist-with-fake-trump-inspired-hate-crime/?
Oh, and… Cough… McAlpine… Cough…
The BBC is impeccable in checking
Anyone but the BBC seems to get it
Ted Cruz
“Fidel Castro’s death cannot bring back his thousands of victims, nor can it bring comfort to their families.
Today we remember them and honor the brave souls who fought the lonely fight against the brutal Communist dictatorship he imposed on Cuba.”
Marco Rubio
“Today let’s remember how #FidelCastro used MIG-29 combat pilots to kill unarmed civilians ”
Donald Trump
Today, the world marks the passing of a brutal dictator who oppressed his own people for nearly six decades,” the statement read. “Fidel Castro’s legacy is one of firing squads, theft, unimaginable suffering, poverty and the denial of fundamental human rights.”
“Though the tragedies, death and pain caused by Fidel Castro cannot be erased, our administration will do all it can to ensure the Cuban people can finally begin their journey toward prosperity and liberty,”
Much is being made of the death of Castro, but no reporting on the atmosphere here in the UK during the Bay of Pigs ‘crisis’ in 1962. I was 14 and remember clearly my Father (a burly coal miner) being extremely worried about the possibility of a nuclear strike. Everyone was talking about it. The headlines were terrifying, there were advertisements on the tele about the 4 minute warning and what to do in the event of a nuclear attack. It was as close to an end-all annihilation as to who would push the button first, that I can remember, and we were only informed by the newspapers and tv reporting in grainy black and white pictures from America.
Brissles, I think you might have mixed up the Bay of Pigs with the Cuban Missile Crisis. The first was a CIA backed attempt by Cuban exiles to depose Castro. It collapsed when President Kennedy refused to commit US forces to support the exiles. The second was an attempt by Russia to base nuclear missiles in Cuba, which would have given Russia a first strike capability. President Kennedy said that he would not allow the Russian missile-carrying ships to reach Cuba. That could have resulted in war. The Russian ships turned back.
Thanks RJ, I stand corrected (things get blurred in the mists of time)
I know that you all can t wait, but I ll remind you 😀
prime Sunday morning viewing spot goes to …
The prime example of BBC luvviness Fern Britton as she gets more airtime on Al Beeb 1,
Fern Britton meets (I know, I know … who cares).
Yep appears she will waffle all things luvvie
to other arch TV luvvie Alexander Armstrong. …
maybe there will be a mirror busting Jo Brand interview coming soon.
… sheesh! give me strenf guvna!
Look, I know it is only Strictly. But just what has Ed Balls got on the producers. No don’t answer that but shall we just assume that his politics are their politics. It is amazing that he has stayed in as long as he has. I watch ‘It takes Two’ and the amount of cheering going on with the people in the studio makes me think that either they are being bribed, bullied or have gone completely round the bend. Mr D bought the Telegraph this morning (we like their General Knowledge crossword). On the front page of the colour supplement was a photo of Balls. I only got as far as the first few words of the article which started by referring to Balls as a ‘National Treasure’. I closed the magazine but before I did I noticed the article was by Mary Ridell. It says everything, I suppose.
On a serious note I presume this is a deliberate attempt by Balls at rehabilitation and it is being supported by the BBC. Last week he had a new book out about the economy which because of his Strictly appearances, got rather more publicity that it probably deserved (it probably didn’t deserve any but this is the BBC). I presume the aim is that his face becomes acceptable when there is a by-election in a Labour stronghold and as a ‘national treasure’ will be parachuted in. Then when Jeremy finaly resigns (is pushed) then Balls can stand for Labour. As ‘national treasure’ be then would be an acceptable leader as all the foolish Labour supporters would think…’dear old Ed’.
Whilst in government he was a bully who worked with Brown, Tom Watson and other less desirables to produce a thoroughly nasty government. I see this as the BBC hoping they are tinkering with Politics to get the return of a Labour government.
Is he a “national treasure” in the sense that treasure is usually better buried under several feet of earth?
We appear to be awash with bloody national treasurers lately. We crossed the line when Barbara Windsor – her of the permanent fancy dress and ex wife of a gangster, was declared such. Clearly the fee inducement of Strictly whilst not getting under Pixie’s feet was a big pull in Ball’s decision to take part. Sadly he is one of those bores who believes he’s funny when he clearly isn’t, and his attempt at witty repartee just comes across as cringeworthy. I seriously don’t believe that the public are voting for him anymore in the numbers indicated, which is why we need to be told the voting figures. Several of the ex professionals on the show have indicated many times that ‘fixes’ are prevalent, so only time will tell.
Any conservative newspaper which employs the likes of Mary Riddell has clearly got a death wish. Can you imagine a left wing newspaper employing a right wing columnist, and producing such pathetic puff pieces for a failed conservative politician?
I don’t know what the weirdo Barclay twins think they are doing with the Daily Telegraph, but they are succeeding in destroying the newspaper which has historically been the bastion of conservative support in this country.
I’d quite like to watch him foxtrot (as in ‘Foxtrot Oscar’)!
(Sorry. Couldn’t resist)
I think that the Strictly audience is merely your average QT audience working weekends, topped up with BBC seat polishers. As to the “public” vote, we only have the BBCs word on that score, afterall, they wouldn’t lie would they?
Deborah, this is an interesting take on your musings:
Cresta Norris: Just watch Ed Balls dance his way back to power
http://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/cresta-norris-just-watch-ed-balls-dance-his-way-back-to-power/
Kollerstrom “Witnessing The Bizarre trial Of Thomas Mair Has Convinced Me He Didn’t Kill Jo Cox MP!”
interesting interview
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lindh
Lindh died in the early morning of 11 September 2003 after a knife attack in Stockholm on the afternoon of 10 September. Just after 4:00 p.m., she was attacked while shopping in the ladies’ section of the Nordiska Kompaniet department store in central Stockholm. Lindh was shopping for new clothes for a televised debate later that night on the referendum about Sweden’s adoption of the euro (which she supported). She was stabbed in the chest, abdomen and arms. At the time of the attack, Lindh was not protected by bodyguards from the Swedish Security Service; this proved controversial, given the similarity between Lindh’s murder and that of prime minister Olof Palme in 1986 (the first murder of a government member in modern Swedish history)
I have made several comments here regarding the anomalies in this case, suggesting that the media (BBC) are complicit in distorting the facts.
I hope to continue the discussion with US friends, but following instructions by comrade gaxvill to ‘move on’ I will refrain from making comments here. I hope as the story unfolds, ridicule directed at me will cease.
The most unusual part of this is a shooting and stabbing victim and not a spot of blood at the scene. Having been the unfortunate witness post stabbing, I can tell you that the gutter was running with blood, and that victim survived!
When Mair was arrested he cut his head, and again there was a visible amount of blood in the street.
It’s just the start of a series of questions which don’t seem to add up.
GWF, I will not ridicule you but just remind you of some realities:
There were several witnesses to what happened, what happened is not disputable, probably what was shouted & heard & reported may be. On that point, I did not follow the case closely so I do not know how thoroughly that was dealt with during the trial.
For the benefit of Thoughtful, depending where & how someone is stabbed and shot how may influence the amounts of blood at a crime scene.
Mair did not plead. If he had not shot & stabbed Cox, why did he not plead & provide information for his defence?
Motive for him as a ‘patsy’ is as important as motive for him as a killer. What benefit does he gain by being a patsy a week in advance for a killing that we now know with hindsight had no favourable outcome to the Remain Campaign in the EU Referendum. He cannot benefit from his crime as things stand. He will stay in prison for the rest of his life unless he makes a successful appeal. I would have thought that he is likely to face harm in prison.
Relying on thriller writers as well as accounts of real world events in the past, I understand it becomes very hard for a conspiracy to remain undiscovered the more people know about it. I think I read somewhere that the number for a successful conspiracy is a maximum of three people before there is a risk of a slip or bravado or guilt leading to information being revealed.
I am not saying definitely that things like this never, ever, happen nor that it could not be impossible in this case but just consider the number of people involved here and necessarily conspiring and it starts to look very vulnerable to me.
I remember being on this web-site when wild theories were posited about the horrible bin lorry crash in Glasgow. There were obvious flaws in those claims. In time, the truth came out. Sometimes, leaving time to unfold is better than fretting and digging away.
Finally, in time the public may well equate those who sought & still seek political advantage (some in the media eg. The Guardian & some of its writers, in the Remain campaign & associated with it) more with smearing the Leave campaign and those associated with it and thus see them as being equally guilty & despicable as Jo Cox’s killer.
The Leave campaign and to an extent Leave voters were smeared by the Remain campaign with the death of Jo Cox. Leave campaigners and voters on here now hold the moral high ground. It is the Remain campaign who are disgraced, whatever the truth about what happened on 16th June.
To maintain that position on the moral high ground, I think a dignified silence is best, something I hope to maintain from now on.
All I will say is that the police have tried and failed to find out where Mair obtained this rifle from. He had never been in any trouble with the police, and did not associate with criminals.
As to his motivation, we cannot know, because he did not explain himself. But we do know that vulnerable people can be manipulated into doing things which are against their own interests. Was Mair susceptible? I don’t know. Did anyone bother to find out?
This is the film of that lady interviewed, there is a part 2 also
Britain First – who said that? eh! … one thing is as certain as Mair committing the murder be certain, the political neo liberal the erm “media party” elite cannot … CANNOT be trusted.
Labour quick off the mark, following the Mair verdict. Declare the political party, Britain First, as a terrorist organization.
I am very suspicious of voices here who insist that we should move on and ask no questions about the trial.
Goodbye for now
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/labour-mp-seeks-debate-on-listing-britain-first-as-terrorist-organisation-35242218.html
Compare and contrast ………….
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38117068
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-38118739
Maybe Jeremy Corbyn can recite the list of countries in which communism has been a success.
I’m waiting……………….?
Still waiting……………..?
Great to see that al beebus are reporting and investigating the recent sexual abuse allegations within the “football community” (?) as sedulously they did the decades long abuse of young, British females by Muslim child rape / child prostitution gangs; which was ignored and obfuscated by the police, local authorities and national government …er..Oh no..Wait..My mistake.
It’s safe for the bbbc to report on these old child abuse cases by football coaches because in those days there were no ‘enrichers’ doing football coaching.
Same with old DJ’s and pop stars.
By the way, isn’t it all still going on, our little children being given a right good ‘enriching’ by the bbbc’s favourites.
My brother is heavily involved in professional football, and when I asked what was going on, he couldn’t understand why its taken two decades for these people to come forward, and why they didn’t report this say, even 10 – 15 years ago.
Three times between 8 am and 8.30 am BBC Breakfast reported as it’s second headline on a dubious report on the spurious hate crime statistics by the Equalities and Human Rights Commission ( surely due for abolition if the Tories ever get serious on a cull of the quangos).Of course it’s all down to Brexiteers.
Then we get a joke of a review of the papers by a Muslim cleric in full garb. It was just an excuse to feed us Muslim propaganda. Will this ever stop? No, of course it won’t until the Government actually does something about BBC bias.
Are there any figures produced by the Equalities and Human Rights Commission for the number of prosecutions in this country for so called ‘hate crime’ ?
I know one hate crime that is never prosecuted or reported …….
Al Beeb and its employees ‘hate’ UKIP, Brexit and Trump.
As predicted the establishment has started its ‘purge’ of groups it doesn’t like. Firstly , as reported in the Sunday Times, it is neo nazi groups, which if reports are true, but of course all reports are possibaly exaggerated these days, deserve to be proscribed , just as many Muslim groups do but aren’t. But it won’t stop there, soon allmanner of groups who hold perfectly legitimate views but which don’t fit with the liberal establishment , will be targeted and then proscribed. Then the witch hunt will move on to individuals as a wave of repression sweeps the UK. If you oppose mass migration, oppose the rapid Islamification of your country , or possibly just speak your mind about Brexit or migration , you will be hounded by the liberal left and the law will be used to shut you up. The dreadful BBC will be fanning the flames and leading the witch hunt.
Yes … I also found it very concerning that the Equalites and Human Rights Commission were promoting that freedom of speech be curtailed … and it was uncritically supported by the UK State Broadcaster.
Once again the BBC is going with opinion as news.
Chris Mason on Radio 4 earlier has used this ‘news’ as another chance to read from the same script he has been reading from, and will continue to read from.
David Isaac from the EHRC was interviewed on Radio 5 and asked for specific examples to back up his claims. Other than again claiming the murder of the Polish man as evidence, he was unable to give any evidence that wasn’t just emotional, anecdotal, just a vague feeling of concern.
Let’s be of no doubt that this is the establishment trying to manipulate thought, as they slide the checker along one more square towards overturning the referendum.
A Critical Referendum on Dec. 4, for Italy and the Euro
“Polls suggest that voters will reject the referendum, delivering a blow to Italy’s economic reforms and continuing an antiestablishment trend that has seen the United Kingdom opt to quit the European Union and Donald J. Trump win the U.S. presidency. In both those instances, opinion polls mostly were wrong.”
So now the media are ‘hoping’ polls are incorrect.
How things have changed. PMSL.
seismicboy
Al Beeb are ‘worried very worried’. Their plans of becoming the European Broadcasting Service are gradually melting like the ‘snowflakes’ in the bright morning sun 🙂
Appallingly soft Marr interview with Emily Thornberry ( Lady Nugee of Rochester). She criticises the Government for not setting out its basic negotiating position on leaving the EU. Funnily no- one ever asks the EU to do likewise ahead of the negotiations. Should the Commission set out its position to the European Parliament? Thornbury, meanwhile, never sets out Labours basic position on any of the issues. Will they want the UK to continue to be members of the Single Market even if we have to concede free movement of people? No straight answer from arrogant Lady N although she sounds very sympathetic to mass immigration . Meanwhile Marr continues to confuse access to the Single Market (which all counties have ) with membership.
The IFS appear to know what the outcome will be as they have made a somewhat audacious, surprisingly vociferous if not political forecast based on it.
Yes, I was unfortunate enough to catch the tail end of that interview.
Marr, quite rightly asked her what she intended to do if the Governments plans were not to her liking.
She claimed she cant answer because they’ve had five months to sort out a strategy. Anyone with more than one braincell would have told her she’s had the same five months to decide what she intends to do…but no…the idiot Marr moves on…..tumbleweed blows from stage left..
Surprised the BBC don’t have a ‘purposes of’ exemption to such lines of questioning when Labour interviewees are not equipped to answer.
EE, and most anti-brexiteers continue to confuse free movement of people as a must-have for continued prosperity and continued technical innovation.
I travel the world and, to be brief, if certain companies / countries outside the EU want my services I get a letter of invitation and then a work permit. It’s not rocket science. In the EU referendum people voted against free movement of people not because they wanted to stop prosperity and innovation. They voted against abuse, ironically a liberal virtue, but not against abuse of immigrants but BY immigrants. If you are a liberal it is not possible to separate the two.
BBC’s Andrew Marr this morning at about 9.20am stated that Austria are about to elect a neo-Nazi as their President.
Isn’t neo-Nazi a rather strong term to describe a European President?
Next, someone will be referring to our Labour leaders as neo-Communists. And that wouldn’t do, of course….
This morning was the fourth time I have heard someone on the radio or TV refer, with a sneer, to Donald Trump having very little hands. The implication clearly being to how manly he.
I take it then that it’s okay to refer to President Obama’s big lips and flat nose?
Quite rich really when it comes from the BBC which is staffed by the most effeminate blokes on the Planet who have a hissy fit if their decaf mocha latte with goats milk is cold
Listening to Farage present the 10-12pm prog on LBC
Caller points out irony
last Year UK politicians sneered at Trump, name called him, tried to ban him from the country.
This year when Trump poked fun at them by saying many people think Farage would be a good ambassador.
…The same people say “Farage oh he’s no diplomat” ….do they have any mirrors ?
The latest BBC4 sat scandy show must have been sponsored by the bBC. Within 30 minutes every PC box had been ticked, intellectually insulting.
FB.. I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who noticed that ! it was all there, mixed race marriage, gay relationships, little girl with special needs, and a clearly white supremacists religious sect involved.
I didn’t watch it, but I am pleased to see that those pesky white supremacists are at it again. Clearly, they are the biggest problem that Sweden has to worry about going forward. Good job that they have enriched their society with peaceful, hard working and definitely non-rapey muslim immigrants isn’t it?
This appears a genuine video made before the referendum with Cameron warning “people thinking of voting leave” cannot get a second referendum
..why haven’t we seen it before ?
Now 19yr old caller is complaining about BBC and her uni lecturers brainwashing re EUref etc.
Farage warns about people like Blair and Farron campaigning for second referendum when they campaigned AGAINST having a referendum in the first place.
Not BBC but both McAfee and Microsoft (windows 10) want to bar access to http://www.conservativewoman.co.uk as being some sort of ‘phishing’ site.
Malicious reporting by SJWs or do any of you know better?
I’m using Windows 10 and have no problem connecting to CW. I suspect something else is at work.
Norton doesn’t have a problem with the site.
My kaspersky anti virus blocks http://www.conservativewoman.co.uk
With the message “the object is infected by HEUR:Trojan.Script.Generic”
It looks like the Royal Family are in trouble.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-38085998
Al Beeb are attempting to keep the ‘brexit re-vote’ debate on the boil.
The British voted out of the EU .
WE want OUT now!
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/133618
Remoaners are Tweeting a story that Farage said if the vote was 52 Remain 48 Leave he would call for a second referendum.
Farage just said
“Actually in that old interview from before the refn quoted in today’s Daily Mirror I said there would be some elements in the Conservative party who would call for a second referendum, but I myself thought the rest of the Conservative party were never going to give us a second chanced so it was important to get over to the public the need to vote this time”
BBC/Labour Switch-on Bingo
just now switched on BBC1 and Sadiq Khan was on the screen
10 minutes later he’s still talking
now pushing electric vehicles cos of pollution.
(Typically a Dramagreens lungs are harmed more by the joint they are smoking rather than your diesel car filtered emissions as you drive past)
..oh he’s just stopped
Delightful little insight to the in-depth political acumen of Paddy Ashdown, talking to Andrew Neil. I quote: ‘If it is democratic to have one referendum, how can it be undemocratic to have two?’
Sums the idiot up rather well, I think.
Why stop at two? We could have them on a weekly basis until the result was to Paddy’s liking when they would no doubt promptly cease.
Beltane, I am ashamed to admit I was in the Royal Marines where he served. I think that many more will be Pi**ed off with him as well.
Nothing to be ashamed of G. I’m sure your service will have been genuine and not coloured with spurious claims of SBS ‘involvement’.
G:
You mean you had the chance to frag the bastard and didn’t? Shameful.
BBC News keep reporting “Hate Crime” against Gays, Jews are up.
..would that be hate coming from misguided ethnic Muslims ?
What on earth are the BBC doing with regard to Rugby Union commentators? Last week they had two Welshmen for a Wales game,(Butler and Davies) Scottish speakers for the Scottish game and a nameless lady commentator (with a pronounced high pitched voice) for the highlights of the English game against Fiji. This week, we enjoyed three Scottish men for the Scots against Georgia, two Welshmen and a South African summariser for the Wales v S Africa game and for the England game against Argentina? Well, we had a Scottish commentator and an English summariser.
The BBC manage to find Welsh speaking commentators for Welsh Pro12 and Welsh schoolboy games. The Scots manage to find Gaelic -speaking commentators for some Scottish club games.
Why can the English games (men) not have native -speaking English commentators ?
England are rated number 2 in the world and surely they should be respected and have their own native-speaking commentator, despite the BBC’s previous love of messrs McLaren, Robertson et al.
I travel widely and cannot think of any other country I have lived and worked in where listeners/viewers would tolerate their international games being described by non- native (and yes,why not biased) commentators- New Zealand? Australia? France? DR Congo? Ghana? Kyrgyzstan? Russia?
Brillo mentioned something
…When there’s talk banks moving from London, remember the EU’s EBA has put in limits on bankers bonuses, so there is a big incentive for managers not to want to move.
I don’t know whether this is biased but it is certainly stupid and irresponsible and highly loaded. BBC article: “Abu Dhabi GP: Would a crash help Lewis Hamilton steal F1 title?”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38086602
a) Stupid: If Lewis Hamilton crashes into Rosberg, Rosberg will win the title as he heads the championship.
b) Irresponsible: Could lead to the death of Hamilton and Rosberg and others.
c) Loaded: Idea that Lewis Hamilton is a cheater and would be “stealing” the title.
d) Another speculative nonsense article, that wastes taxpayers money, and does not report the news (sports news in this instance).
Some of us remember Michael Schumacher’s “completely accidental” collision with Damon Hill at Adelaide in 1994. When Schumacher turned in to cause the collision he coincidentally ensured that he won the Driver’s Championship.
BoBotC, you are right. More evidence that the BBC are losing the plot. In addition see david01’s observant post above re Rugby Football. It is now obvious that quite a lot is amiss at Broadcasting House.
I wonder whether they are drowning under a tsunami of complaints from all directions about everything and have developed a total bunker mentality that is destroying the quality of their output.
Apparently Trevor Noah* was on Peston slagging off Farage, saying he American’s have a low opinion of him.
* (South African comic who is the new Johnny Carson talkshow host)
Yes looks like it in this recent video /sarc
The bBBC has been right all along.
All Brexit voters are racists.
The EHRC has just decreed so.
News : London 1am Kurdish families tried to storm Broadcasting House
“but a quick thinking security guard managed to lock them out. 100 protesters
..
Kurds have marched through London in previous years to protest against the Turkish government ”
more in the Sun
Lock them out? As they are not welcome due to security concerns?
The BBC really should consider a wall or something.
GW, did they arrive by boat up the Thames and get a free taxi ride to the BBC?
So, the Muslim migrants to the UK have voiced their dissatisfaction with publicly funded housing have they? Well, I know the response to that beginning with capital F and ending with a small f.
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/11/uk-50-of-muslim-migrants-complain-taxpayer-funded-housing-completely-inadequate
From the article:
Who can deny that “foreigners” have historically contributed to Britain?
That is a very broad statement. Whilst historically some have probably contributed a lot, over the past 20 years we have seen our immigrant population rise very rapidly without any meaningful increase in capacity of the NHS, schools, roads, railways etc. which are all now under massive pressure – in other words, not only are these millions of immigrants not bringing a ‘net economic benefit’ to the the UK (as the BBC keeps telling), they are not even paying for their own keep.
Add to that the vast amount of money they are sending back to their countries of origin……
Who can deny that “foreigners” have historically contributed to Britain?
Not only is it a broad statement, it’s a plainly meaningless statement. Everybody is a contributor, and everybody is a taker. The only meaningful measure is net contributor.
The fact is that very few of us are net contributors, hence why our borrowings keep rising. The chances of somebody being a net contributor is small, but the chances of a foreigner being a net contributors is minuscule.
“very few of us are net contributors” – And that number is getting smaller.
I used to be a net contributor up to a few years ago. Now I get by on temp jobs interspersed with the dole now and again. After I left my last permanent job I basically knew that I wanted to contribute as little as possible, to a country that seemed so hell bent on ruining itself. Basically I’m doing a ‘going Galt’ lite!
They take my hard-earned tax money and redistribute it to every conceivable thing that I disagree with, or on people and organisations that despise me.
To be honest I look forward to the day when there is no more work and I’m getting back all my NI inputs from over the years! -before the entire welfare budget (including state pensions) collapses.
We have had Cameron in a coalition and with a majority, now Theresa May. Are they that distinguishable from Blair and Brown?
I might amend my gloomy outlook if we see a complete and absolute hard Brexit actually occur – but what political force will ensure it, where’s the new UKIP?
Who can deny that “foreigners” have historically contributed to Britain?
It’s also a challenge to those who want to point out that some groups of immigrants contribute far more than others. They know perfectly well that many people are very reluctant to single out the net contributors and the net takers.
People are well aware that the current crop of economic immigrants fall overwhelmingly into the latter category. Hence Brexit.
“falls” not “fall”
I told you I went to see the presentation by the 2 experts who wrote the report saying immigration is a net contributor to the UK economy
..They were very poor unimpressive speakers
..So I would challenge the robustness of their findings.
Whereas 7-8 years previously I’d been to a Sir Andrew Green lecture (Migrationwatch) and he was very impressive.
How many weeks ago was it that the BBC announced that anchor men would stay in the studio? No more than 4 I would guess. So why did WATO today have both Mark Mardell and Gary O’Donaghue reporting from the US. When Gary was interviewing Floridian Cubans about Castro, I wondered how he found the ones he wanted to speak to (not least as he is blind and would have had no visual clues). But I guess the local reporters probably searched out the people with the approved BBC view of Castro and it is they who could have filed the pieces.
“Gary O’Donoghue is an English journalist, currently working for BBC News as their Washington, D.C. political correspondent.”
Mardell is UK bases presenter
was he really in the US or speaking over the line from UK ?
That’s two plus the official North America Editor Jon Sopel and there also may be other correspondents, Katty Kay, etc. How do they justify the carbon footprint in view of Anthropogenic Global Warming and Climate Change?
Someone compares James O’Brien to other LBC presenters
JP @jonPfulham 40m40 minutes ago
@LBC when someone disagrees with @KTHopkins or @Nigel_Farage they listen and are pleasant to them and say thanks for the call
@LBC @KTHopkins @Nigel_Farage when someone disagrees with @mrjamesob he shouts them down is rude and condescending.
Sky News, this morning, one of the talking heads this morning on the alleged news channels said that we should have another referendum ‘to sort the matter out’ and ‘its all cameroon’s fault for having a referendum in the first place’…………It is sad to watch but it is slow but sure chip chip, nibble nibble until they can airbrush out the result of the referendum and then we can all get on with more extreme political correctness and far left wing fascism.
bbbc is in the same full on mode………..
These days I find that Sky and the BBC are indistinguishable from each other, which is why I cancelled my Sky subscription.
One simply was collateral from the other for me.
So I ended up £142.50 plus £200 pa better off.
Which was nice.
Not sure what the end of run GoT box set will be, mind.
This appears a genuine video made before the referendum with Cameron warning “people thinking of voting leave” they cannot get a second referendum
..why haven’t we seen it before ?
In other words what this report is saying is that you shouldn’t discuss immigration because if you do you are racist. What a loathsome crew the Left are/ They have damaged this country and are hellbent on further destroying it. We must stand up and fight though. The Left really are disgusting beyond words.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38120596
Always love a nice BBC ‘urge’ headline, which tends to suggest that someone they are not sure will swing it as a headline anchor has sent them a press release.
This has started appearing all over the place
The 2015 European referendum act states in article 19 that NO COURT can challenge the result after 6 weeks of the announcement of the result
Sure enough….
No court may entertain any proceedings for questioning the number of
ballot papers counted or votes cast in the referendum as certified by the
Chief Counting Officer or a Regional Counting Officer or counting officer
unless—
(a) the proceedings are brought by a claim for judicial review, and
(b) the claim form is filed before the end of the permitted period.
(2) In sub-paragraph (1) “the permitted period” means the period of 6 weeks
beginning with—
(a) the day on which the officer in question gives a certificate as to the
number of ballot papers counted and votes cast in the referendum, or
(b) if the officer gives more than one such certificate, the day on which
the last is given.
Thanks for that Number 6.
BBC Online News:
“”Brexit, the pound and the price of fish””
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38108780
Yes, the cost of fish has gone up. But if we had our own waters as we had before the EU, this would not be a problem.
But the BBC “”forgets”” to mention this. To do so would support Brexit. And for the BBC, that would never, ever do.
Of course, food prices will fall once we’re out of the EU and can remove the Common Customs Tariff from the food we import from the rest of the world.
The problem will be if we accept a “soft Brexit” deal that keeps us inside the single market and compels us to retain the Common Tariff. Strangely, the BBC’s “experts” and others in favour of “soft Brexit” never mention this disadvantage.