Parliament returns Tuesday . The Biased BBC will be ready to criticise the PM for either not returning – or returning before he is ready . The continuing lack of support for any government effort is constant across the days . Maybe a few more people are noticing …..
Start the Week Thread 20 April 2020
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A question.
We have been in lockdown for four weeks.
So how come the ‘pillar 1’ new C19 cases are at the same level as 3 weeks ago?
By what process did these people contact the virus?
Or do we assume the virus is in fact exceptionally virulent and there was simply vast under-reporting a month ago?
Next question.
Why is the death rate so high one month after lockdown?
Next question. The ‘pillar 2’ key worker testing yesterday accounted for over a third of all new cases !!!!
Now these were not being measured a month ago.
So could it be that key workers are in fact one of the main ways the virus is now spreading? I mean, how else do care home residents in lockdown pick up the virus? Is this an inconvenient truth?
I understand that the raw testing numbers do not give the full picture. I understand the effect of the incubation period and we know from Boris about the recovery period.
But even so, the numbers do not stack up with the explanations we have been given.
I think there is something missing here from the general debate.
Maybe the public should be worried out PPE for key workers – but not for the reason most would expect.
No wonder people without C19 but with heart attacks are afraid to go into hospital.
Sluff
We all know that data are only as good as the collection process and we know that the reporting/collection of CV19 data have been cr*p.
So I really don’t know why numbers are even reported – except to keep scaring everyone and to beat up the Govt.
All I want to know is – are the deaths over this period outside of what would be expected over the last 3 months.
JamesArther – I wrote earlier to look at the Telegraph which shows ‘unexplained death ‘ numbers which show a huge increase compared to hospital numbers ….
Do your own research I don’t do links
Sluff, in one of those twists of fate that occur in life, I happened to meet the owner of an industrial cleaner some years ago. Was sat next to them at a meal. This person’s business did most of their cleaning for the music business, working for companies that pressed CDs and the then new-ish DVDs. We had an interesting conversation.
The ‘factories’ where commercial CD/DVD pressings are made had to be cleaned to an incredibly high standard and were, in fact, like very high technology surgical operating theatre environments. The level at which they had to be cleaned was 98-100% of ‘perfect’. The tiniest bit of grit or dust could ruin ‘a run’ of say, 500,000 CDs (for a major artiste) and obviously lead to a delay in the release of an album. Back then CDs cost pennies to the trade but the overall costs to the artiste, their management, their label, the publicists and to the repro Co. would all mount up if even a modest ‘run’ had to be scrapped.
An obvious question popped into my head: “Do you ever get asked to clean hospital Operating Theatres?” “Yes.” ~ which was followed by: “When you first go in, have they been cleaned by the staff and, if so, to what level, according to your standards?”
The reply was interesting. “Yes but not very well, usually well below our standards. It depends on the people involved and their management; it also depends on the facility, the age of the hospital, how new and whether it’s a theatre for really critical surgery.” Some chat followed about infinity curves for walls on floors and ceilings, air conditioning and air filtration, waste management and other factors.
When pressed, this industrial cleaning business owner reckoned on average, operating theatres were cleaned to no better than an 80 per cent-something standard of cleanliness. This was around the time that HAIs (Hospital Acquired Infections) were just starting to become newsworthy.
Thanks FedUp2
I understand your point and had done the research and it was clear that the death rate as recorded in stats has increased significantly over the last few weeks (it seems mainly from care homes) – but prior to that the figures were all within normal ( up to 20th March and maybe 31st March)…not that the media would have told you that.
The ONS figures and the GOV.uk figures are also different to each other due to ways of collecting…
I am not suggesting that more people are not dying, but it is more clear now that the vast bulk are as suspected, the older and with underlying health conditions
Therefore if we follow science – there is an answer to opening up the lockdown, whilst focusing protection on the most vulnerable…
Which I guess was my badly made point earlier…just giving numbers without qualification or appropriate analysis is worthless and increases anxiety.
JamesA ( generally )
Does any one really think that the most vulnerable – in the proper medic sense – not the way the BBC abuses that word – could be protected ?
It would mean enclosing care homes with a full staff and resident lock down until a cure is found . The ‘they’ll die anyway line will be rolled out’ which as glib as saying – we re all gonna die so why bother .
For some death would come as a mercy – for others – anything but – that’s the trouble with grouping people by arbitrary things like age .
I have no personal connection to Care Homes but I feel strongly that people who have done their bit get something back .
As for the stats – GP s certifying death will know what will be looked at and what will not . I’m guessing that putting pneumonia on the certificate will get less of a look than the Chinese virus .
MSM won’t be looking at any of this because they’d rather be showing people clapping and wealthy ‘celebrities ‘ making themselves feel good …..
If any one at 1435 has the TV Parliament channel is back with the commons – looking – strange ..
Sluff – judging by the ‘unexplained death ‘ numbers coming out – I’d go with ‘vast under reporting ‘- and as I repeat from before – in brutal terms – the hospital numbers are a distraction( ok too brutal – part of the issue ) -or at least – the peak of the iceberg .
And even more brutally – after the dust settles – the emotion attached to NHS staff and their PPE will be second place to what it going on in peoples’ homes and care homes .
But obviously for the MSM the ‘plight’ of medical professionals is far sexier- particularly when they go on the media at the drop of a hat to do political broadcasts for the Labour Party (NHS) or lie about PPE shortages ….
Not AntiBBC but Airport Watch, Day 18.
JFK to LHR, Airbus A350 arriving at 08.30. Pax, not cargo.
Miami to LHR, Boeing 777 arriving at 08.35. Pax.
NY to LHR, Dreamliner arriving at 09.00. Pax
Many more flights from the States in-bound in the next hour or so and I checked last night around 21.30 to see we’d just welcomed some super new arrivals from another flyblown …hole – Lagos.
Meanwhile the good citizens of the UK remain locked-down and no one from the MSM challenges the ‘science’ when the medical officials claim the risk from persons on these flights is negligible.
Note for Fed, for info the term ‘Pax’ short hand for passengers.
WW
Continuing good work on this.
As early as March 6th, Indian airports were checking the temperatures of passengers on arrival and requiring health forms to be filled in with contact details – all before passport control. Meanwhile many hotels were taking visitor temperatures on each and every occasion a guest went in through the door.
By mid month India had cancelled all its incoming visas.
The open door immigration policies of the UK Open Border Force are clearly more important than protecting the British public.
TWW, it must be a nightmare for our Fed when a Pax arrives at LAX and wants to arrange FX.
Sorry also not AntiBBC but any ideas what flight PC12 is? Took off from Ostend and been going up and down over the West Midlands.Aerial photography/mapping or something more sinister?
West – thanks for the pax – I ask generally for clarity in abbreviations – not for me – but for anyone reading this blog …
I learned what ccbgb yesterday ( comments could be going better )
Anyway -I watch the flights too – and as I live on the ‘finals’ of both stansted and heathrow I watch the planes app too .
The government is incompetent in either not carrying out health checks or allowing aircraft in at all . The same goes with the many private jets which now stick out like an injured thumb
It makes enforcement of the lock down look shoddy and any the advice of any ‘medics ‘ looking dumb and lacking in common sense .
And on aviation – I really hope the 2 million pounds compensation that Branson got from the taxpayers in the case against the NHS costs him that airline – there is no way it should be bailed out by the taxpayer – let the Americans finish it off and leave another sneering tax avoider on his island
Cheers Fed,
Virgin Australian (10% stake owned by Beardy Branson) called in the receivers overnight/this morning.
Regarding the face mask issue. Now if we are told to wear one, i will wear one, i have no issues. However …
If the guidance does change , expect a absolute onslaught from the BBC.
Even though, in every press conference the scientists have told us that they are monitoring data daily on the use of masks for the public, and they have continually said that if any data changes to make it guidance to wear one, they will let us know.
All fair enough !! Wont be enough for the BBC and MSM.
Cries of U-Turn will be heard far and wide from the bubble. I am actually dreading the moment they advise us to wear them as the BBC smugness, anti government rhetoric will blow thru the roof.
I used to wear face masks in construction and they raise the bodies temperature.
If our police state dictates we wear them in public , it will be interesting to see how the people cope in a heatwave. Will I be able to play the asthma card to avoid the humiliation ????
It’s the roaring twenties! … I’m thirsty…where are the speakeasies?????
Maybe American Prohibition would have succeeded if they’d branded it as saving the health system and the youth movement had draw rainbows everywhere
In fact where is any kind of pushback, to use BBC speak we are sleepwalking into something nasty.
I shall not be wearing one and I shall not be swayed by the wearing one ‘saving lives’ bull****
The science is far from proven as our ‘most trusted’ had regularly been telling us, until now.
However, now the odious little man, Mayor Khant has called for it, again, the AntiBBC have jumped on the bandwagon.
If Mayor Khant was really concerned with the spread of disease on public transport he’d have closed the tubes.
There is only one reason the AntiBBC and the little man are pushing the use of face coverings in public.
Its in order to comply with the rules of their chosen ‘religon’
BBC lies
BBC thinks its good
BBC admits to click bait
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Not directly Al Beeb, but one of their long term luvvies, ‘Sir’ Tony Robinson of Blackadder fame (and little of note since) is currently advertising commemorative coins from The London Mint (Not the Royal Mint) using the slogan ‘Money Talks’.
Robinson is lifelong Leftoid and a Labour Party Member until last year when he quit because of the Corbynutta’s duplicity on Brexit. Robinson’s problem was that Labour wasn’t supporting a second referendum.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48152475
Money clearly talks for Leftoid Robinson.
Peter Grimes
The Tony “never done a real job ” Robinson , that one ?
Champagne socialist – “knighted for his public and political service in 2013. “
BBC ‘Could’ News
High air pollution could raise the risk of dying from Covid-19, but medical professionals said it’s too early to prove a direct relationship.
Still, worth passing on anyway.
Hang on, weren’t the ‘most trusted’ saying that air pollution levels had fallen all across the world recently??
No issue then….
They make me puke.
Guest Who
An useful “could”- Could the Tory Party be afraid of Al Beeb ?
Too afraid to get rid of the Telly Tax ? Too afraid to de-criminalise it ?
Love the heading, it just needs a hash tag. Hope you don’t mind me copying your style.
BBC Could News
BiasedBBC poster says ” the reason why many NHS staff aren’t getting tests could be that they’d rather have a plausible excuse for staying home and leaving their colleagues to face the risk”.
EUTV
Then Al Beeb must be full of experts?
Sorry,
I made an edit and lost the paragraph about experts hiding their lack of confidence using words like could, may and might.
The evidence against that ‘BBC theory’ is colossal.
India – one of the countries in the world with the worst air pollution – has the lowest Covid-19 infections and deaths in the world, in proportion to its population, according to the Johns Hopkins figures.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-51235105
Whenever I hear Ramadam I end up singing…….
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-52323416
So here the BBC laments a dramatic drop in airport flights (arrivals/departures) to 10% of normal. Remember, 10% is an awful lot of flights from all over the world considering where we were!
My question is why are any non freight/essential flights continuing from anywhere? Why are we not, like Australia, The US and most advanced nation banning international travel?
My belief is that it is such an anathema to our liberal political class to shut borders. They simply can’t and won’t do it.
It’s also beyond the BBC to ask the Qs I ask because they’re all part of the same group think!
So while you’re locked down – little Trojan horses arrive every day from infected countries with little or no checks. It’s an absolute disgrace, like the dinghy’s that pop up on our shores daily!
Borders are open because the curve is considered TOO flat.
Instead of the NHS being overwhelmed its being underwhelmed.
Remember the idea from the start is herd immunity, a constant and manageble drip rate of people getting infected.
And no new cases mean we’d have to be released from lockdown , and we haven’t been in long enough for their long term police state behavioural training to be most effective.
No. The initial policy WAS herd immunity. Boris et al then panicked (media, rising deaths etc) so the policy then became lockdown, copying most EU countries.
Australia, NZ, Israel, USA and most sensible first rate countries have also shut their borders to non essential flights. The idea behind this is to protect their people, deal with what the virus presents internally and halt further incursion from outside (quite right).
You cannot run a country’s virus emergency response based solely on the capacity of its health system to cope. It’s insane.
We are theoretically then drip feeding infection, ad infinitum, with open borders. Yes the bucket will never get full. Yes, our heath system will cope, but to what end? Never-ending virus? Hot spots of infection when plane loads of (let’s say) Iranians visit their extended families? How would you feel when their children pass it to their school mates? To your family?
I say again. The policy of not shutting borders has more to do with the liberal DNA of our political class, supported by our state broadcaster.
Why else are logical and reasonable questions like mine not being asked? Why else does an article around flights on our state broadcaster not even mention additional infection risk from continued travel?
Victoria Derbyshire interviewing the BBC’s numbers specialist (Yes they have one of those too!)
He commented that the death rate was the highest in the past month since 2010.
Obvious question VD might have asked as I don’t remember lock-down, rainbows, placards, PPE inquisitions, continuous news spewing out, number crunching, police crackdowns etc. then.
“So what happened in 2010?”
Of course this didn’t happen……
@Digg Ed Conway mentioned that this weeks deaths were NOT the highest week ever and indicated a graph
So if 2010 has a high April I expect it would show on this graph
BUT it doesn’t
The other high weeks
1970: week 2, 20.006k Hong Kong influenza
There was something similar at the end of 1989
And at the start of 2000
https://nuggetcharts.com/chart/829
EUTV,
Me too. Ramma Lamma Ding Dong. 🙂
This came to mind when former President Obama was first in the news. I couldn’t hear his name without hearing……
Oh my god, yes.
I know a lot of these regular talking heads get an appearance fee (albeit a few hundred quid), but some of them are really coining it in with their opinions/advice etc on Covid19..
Not BBC sorry, but on Sky there is a Dr Simon Clark, Microbiologist at the Uni of Reading, who is on daily, answering the continual boring questions from the public, so he must be racking up account with fees from his appearances. I have to switch off, as its like Groundhog Day.
Naomi Klein on Today says that Donald Trump is “losing his mind” and needs to be replaced by Joe Biden. This statement is not even challenged, never mind ridiculed, by Mishal Husain.
I began to wonder why leftists cannot see things as they really are and so often get things back to front. It must be because of habits formed in childhood. Perhaps they learned to believe the lies of duplicitous parents in order to survive the deceitful atmosophere of their upbringings. Perhaps dealing with unreliable, neglectful, distant or absent parents required the wearing of rose-coloured specs or the generation of utopian visions. Perhaps irrational parents destroyed their incipient faith in the rudiments of logic.
Zelazek,
Don’t forget the disgraceful levels of ‘edukashun’ the children are brainwashed into believing.
“So as a dog-faced pony soldier, why do you think Biden would make a better president, and should we lock-up our daughters?”
Hi Zelazek I agree with you that the better we can understand the mindset of those we scrutinise here, and why it operates the way it does is very important to try and neutralize it. I too have thought long and hard about this and posted my observations here a few years back. Perhaps you’ll find it helpful and stimulating.
https://biasedbbc.proboards.com/thread/2810/psychological-mindset-operating-bbc
Teddy Bear,
Thanks for that link. A very enjoyable read. Your analysis is sound, your arguments strong. And the quality of your discussion with Doublethinker and others is why I love this site. And you put your finger on our problem: How do we argue with people who are so quick to close down discussion by accusing us of being bigots, fascists, racists, sexists, homophobes, transphobes, Islamophobes, etc.? That is a difficult question. The only answer I have come up with is to become more articulate than our enemies. Logical argument will not normally work unless it is distilled down to a pithy, unanswerable point. For example, the only time I felt I managed to win an argument with my lefty colleagues at work was when I took issue with them for saying that Donald Trump was stupid. I asked them the question, “How does a stupid man come to dominate the real estate business in Manhattan?” I was met with silence.
Zel – Thanks for your reply and I know we operate from similar experiences. The Catch-22 for us is that winning the argument doesn’t give us victory, it merely drives the ‘left’ to resort to even more blatant brainwashing. History shows us that the only way we have ever turfed out these types is by war. Since our minds are better developed we win these wars. If we are to learn from history the next time we win we have to make sure we hold on to the positions of power. This has been our biggest drawback – we don’t seek power – we seek love, harmony and satisfaction from our endeavours. So the ones who seek it are those who need it to validate their being regardless of the real damage done to our society as a result.
The biggest example we see at this moment in time is how Trump is ridiculed for calling out the questionable policies of the Chinese in how they’ve responded to this virus. The left would rather see our society suffer the deaths and chaos it has caused than upset the similar ambitions of these other power seeking dictators.
DIM – DIMINISHED – DHIMMI
I’ve just reread the link to your piece about the BBC psychological mindset. Thanks for making it available here.
A factor which you don’t mention is boredom or excess energy. If you spend a day at the coal-face, or even at the chalk-face, you are likely to be tired at the end of it, even if in some way fulfilled. You will have less excess energy for criticism of things for its own sake, and higher self-worth.
One obvious exception to this is students, who may have lots of energy as young people, plus the time and freedom to go on demonstrations. They may have low self-worth, as they have had little chance to achieve much, and feel they are doing something noble by, say, opposing nuclear missiles or Brexit.
Now imagine a journalist with a good degree in English Literature or Psychology. Much of the news reporting (s)he is required to do may be rather routine, with little scope to shine; it will often be a let down after studying Joyce, Freud or Marx at college. This might not be true of Kuenssberg or Easton, but many others below them will be underemployed and possibly bored.
The old expression for this was, “the devil finds work for idle hands”. Pol Pot might have sent them out into the fields, hating intellectuals and finding a use for their excess energy. The undermining of the existing order by BBC “Lefties” may owe something to their existential ‘ennui’, with no wars to fight or tiring work to do.
Of course this theory of mine doesn’t fully explain the political slant of the professional carpers, since bored intellectuals might just as well attack the British state from libertarian Right positions as collectivist Left ones.
Hi Must’ and thanks for your input and credible addition. I would agree that many are fence sitters who decided life is easier to ‘go with the flow’ rather than think independently. As admitted by many posters here that it wasn’t until they were affected personally by any of the various agendas put forward by the left that they realised how insidious it truly was – and they ‘woke up’.
Thinking about it you might have touched upon a very important and valuable tool for use by us. If we can find a way to ‘wake’ the masses by friendly guidance and stimulation rather than just winning the arguments perhaps we can win the war without the need to ultimately fight.
Looking at the last ONS data.
It looks to me that PPE equipment in care homes is needed more for the residents than for the staff who are bringing the virus in to work with them.
Which suggests that testing key workers is more important in care homes than PPE.
The whole thing Kinda makes the term ‘care home ‘ a bit redundant doesn’t it ?
An —-ing tragedy – let’s all clap.
Whatever your views on the virus it is unforgivable the way care homes and their residents have been left to fend for themselves. To abandon very vulnerable and old people in this way is no mark of a civilised society. My wife worked in a dementia home for years and said right at the beginning of this that they were very vulnerable. Now the government, the NHS and our doctors must have known this yet did nothing.
‘Our NHS’ is the subject of adulation and a strange worship but the old have been left to die and those looking after them to endure the hardship and the worry. The relatives have been ignored.
Turning away the old from hospital and doctors refusing to visit tells me that our society is dying. All involved need to look to their consciences.
And I am sorry but a nation has leaders and they have failed too. I hope they will face the contempt they deserve.
The NHS is concerned that people are not seeking help when illness strikes. Is it any wonder ?
Most care homes are private sector.
Maybe the nationalised public sector NHS thinks that the evil private sector (only in it for the money) get whats coming to them….
But perish the thought we would get nationalised care homes – presumably with pictures of great socialists on the walls……..and all in the same places……
Dave – Let us go, for a moment, with the assumption that we are in the ‘End Times’ (Pandemic, Chinese go nuclear, asteroid, whatever).
In the Book of Revelation Jesus (John, on Patmos, is only the scribe -as Chap 1 makes clear) may well be speaking to the final Church Age:
“I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot…Because thou sayest I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor and blind, and naked…(Rev 3-17)
Is this not a perfect description of where we have arrived? Does it not perfectly explain the ‘why’ of the situation you have outlined?
The Angel Of the Covenant is speaking, and his symbol is the Rainbow. I wonder -with all these rainbows up- whether anyone knows what they really mean? Strange worship of the NHS you say? Indeed.
DS
All the following is true.
I am exceptionally ill informed about current care homes in the UK.
Such personal experience as I do have is limited to one care home, twenty years ago, where my mother, who had dementia, was being looked after.
She was being looked after, the staff, mostly on minimum wage, were golden.
My family were paying for this care and had there been any issues we would have complained immediately.
There were no issues to complain about.
The problems started when my mother had a fall and was taken to the nearest hospital in an ambulance. This was a precaution. The hospital advised the care home that my mother would be kept in for a week.
Almost immediately Person A suggested to a member of my family that it might be a good idea to have my mother moved to another nearby hospital. Which they named.
A few hours later, Person B suggested to another member of my family that it might be a good idea to have my mother moved to another nearby hospital. Which they also named.
These two incidents were the subject of family discussions.
A day later Person C suggested to me that it would be best if my mother was moved to another nearby hospital.
Which they named.
The same hospital was named in all three cases where my family received advice.
I tackled Person C about the advice we had received.
Person C denied making any statements and advised me that other people would also deny making statements.
Person C then told me “get your mother moved to [named Hospital] or she will die”. End of conversation.
My family could not believe this, we did not have our mother moved. My mother died six days later.
My family were persuaded not to take legal action about the death of our mother.
Our solicitor did not seem surprised to learn that in a certain hospital patients were dying from neglect.
My family knew that there was one local hospital where patients were not only dying from neglect, but were known to be dying from neglect.
The advice my family received was to have my mother moved to one, specified, hospital. We inferred that this was because there was at least one more local hospital with a (probably deserved) reputation for neglecting their patients.
A national treasure?
Whatever your views on the virus it is unforgivable the way care homes and their residents have been left to fend for themselves. To abandon very vulnerable and old people in this way is no mark of a civilised society. My wife worked in a dementia home for years and said right at the beginning of this that they were very vulnerable. Now the government, the NHS and our doctors must have known this yet did nothing.
‘Our NHS’ is the subject of adulation and a strange worship but the old have been left to die and those looking after them to endure the hardship and the worry. The relatives have been ignored.
Turning away the old from hospital and doctors refusing to visit tells me that our society is dying. All involved need to look to their consciences.
And I am sorry but a nation has leaders and they have failed too. I hope they will face the contempt they deserve.
The NHS is concerned that people are not seeking help when illness strikes. Is it any wonder ?
https://news.sky.com/story/the-restaurant-that-burns-off-calories-show-hosted-by-first-dates-star-criticised-by-eating-disorder-charity-11976437
Piss poor programming from the envy of the world top class broadcaster, and subsequent criticism.
Scrap it!
I often wonder why anyone bothers to go into politics. I defy any government – be it red/blue or pink with spots on, to get everything right even most of the time.
Who would want a job in this government at all right now ? constantly been criticised, facing continual ‘gotcha’ questions, and making decisions which are reliant on the advice of supposed experts.
Would a Labour/Soc Dem government do any better ? I doubt it, yet day in day out we are subjected to endless reports and commentaries by those who think they know better. Well lets see them try.
The government can only play the cards they’re dealt. If they were slow in locking down, it was on advice not to do it too quickly, not enough respirators – silly old government they should have got these ordered last autumn or should that have been NHS logistics departments, and the same for the PPEs.
We are where we are, and the constant harping about a ‘failed’ government is a useless exercise. No government around the world has come out of this with any glory, so we should’nt be too quick to judge.
I agree. So many touchline internationals in the media, on the opposition benches, there are even a few on this site. All are entitled to an opinion but what is never ever questioned is the role that the bloated, lazy, inept public sector has played in all this.
Take out those anychess workers at the coal face, delivering the care (although lord only knows where they find time to choreograph, rehearse and film all those dance routines!!) and there is exposed a creaking, lumbering incompetent state machine that is nowhere near fit for purpose.
Wherever this govt has been criticised during this crisis, it has usually been the case that it has had to fall on its sword because those that get paid handsomely to make sure the wheels keep turning cannot hack it when the call comes to pedal faster.
No PPE in the right places (all stuck in warehouses), NHS logistics fault so let’s get the army in to sort the mess out.
Potential shortages of PPE in the system, NHS procurement found wanting so let’s send for the bloke that helped organise the Olympics.
Shortage of ventilators, no problem, the private sector will come together to design and build thousands of new ones within a few days only to have them sat waiting until god knows when for approval by some public sector organisation that probably doesn’t meet until the third Wednesday in the month.
Thousands of Trojan horses descend from the skies and climb off ribs to disappear into the ether without being checked or quarantined.
High ranking police officers don’t have the wherewithal to interpret government guidelines and give meaningful instructions to over zealous plod resulting in people walking alone on beaches being publicly shamed but a thousand blind eyes turned away from Muslims congregating around mosques.
Local authorities can’t organise anything to do with elderly social care because 30% of their staff are home in the garden pretending to self isolate.
Finally, the real bloody beauty, the biased b*****d bbc. The most bloated and inefficient public sector organisation of them all, refuses to handle news in anything like an even handed way. Too lazy to check sources, too thick to see ulterior motives that are obvious to everyone else. Too stupid to see their obvious treachery is easily spotted by most.
What do they all have in common? Not one of them has lost his job, not one has had to take a pay cut, not one has been furloughed. All still being paid in full, all accruing holidays, all still entitled to their gold plated pensions.
Despise them as they despise us.
I agree. So many touchline internationals in the media, on the opposition benches, there are even a few on this site. All are entitled to an opinion but what is never ever questioned is the role that the bloated, lazy, inept public sector has played in all this.
Take out those anychess workers at the coal face, delivering the care (although lord only knows where they find time to choreograph, rehearse and film all those dance routines!!) and there is exposed a creaking, lumbering incompetent state machine that is nowhere near fit for purpose.
Wherever this govt has been criticised during this crisis, it has usually been the case that it has had to fall on its sword because those that get paid handsomely to make sure the wheels keep turning cannot hack it when the call comes to pedal faster.
No PPE in the right places (all stuck in warehouses), NHS logistics fault so let’s get the army in to sort the mess out.
Potential shortages of PPE in the system, NHS procurement found wanting so let’s send for the bloke that helped organise the Olympics.
Shortage of ventilators, no problem, the private sector will come together to design and build thousands of new ones within a few days only to have them sat waiting until god knows when for approval by some public sector organisation that probably doesn’t meet until the third Wednesday in the month.
Thousands of Trojan horses descend from the skies and climb off ribs to disappear into the ether without being checked or quarantined.
High ranking police officers don’t have the wherewithal to interpret government guidelines and give meaningful instructions to over zealous plod resulting in people walking alone on beaches being publicly shamed but a thousand blind eyes turned away from Muslims congregating around mosques.
Local authorities can’t organise anything to do with elderly social care because 30% of their staff are home in the garden pretending to self isolate.
Finally, the real bloody beauty, the biased b*****d bbc. The most bloated and inefficient public sector organisation of them all, refuses to handle news in anything like an even handed way. Too lazy to check sources, too thick to see ulterior motives that are obvious to everyone else. Too stupid to see their obvious treachery is easily spotted by most.
What do they all have in common? Not one of them has lost his job, not one has had to take a pay cut, not one has been furloughed. All still being paid in full, all accruing holidays, all still entitled to their gold plated pensions.
Despise them as they despise us.
BRISSLES
A Labour/Soc Dem government would not have to face the endless barrage of “gotcha” questions.
If only the people had had the sense to vote for Mr Corbyn, vote to Remain in the EU and vote for Hillary in the US in 2016 this crisis could have been avoided.
Personally, given the choice, I would still take my chances with corona than any of the said options.
Prob on BBC somewhere
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/apr/21/tommy-robinson-accused-syrian-teen-of-attacking-girl-judge-finds
Robinson, 37, whose real name is Stephen Yaxley-Lennon, then posted two videos on Facebook claiming Jamal was “not innocent and he violently attacks young English girls in his school”.
Dave – Let us go, for a moment, with the assumption that we are in the ‘End Times’ (Pandemic, Chinese go nuclear, asteroid, whatever).
In the Book of Revelation, Jesus (John, on Patmos, is only the scribe -as Chap 1 makes clear) may well be speaking to the final Church Age:
“I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot…Because thou sayest I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor and blind, and naked…(Rev 3-15-17)
Is this not a perfect description of where we have arrived? Does it not perfectly explain the ‘why’ of the situation you have outlined?
The Angel Of the Covenant is speaking, and his symbol is the Rainbow. I wonder -with all these rainbows up- whether anyone knows what they really mean? Strange worship of the NHS you say? Indeed.
Footnote: ‘John’ is writing to the seven Churches in Asia, but he says quite clearly that the Book is a prophesy, so there may well be seven Church ages, and this may well be the last.
I’ve spent the day looking at ONS errors
then SkyNews maths errors
Were there really 41% more Covid19 deaths than hospital deaths ?
What is the golden rule of comparing stats ?
Don’t compare Oranges with Apples !
So if you have ONS-Apples of actual date deaths
you cannot compare them against PHE-Oranges of hospital deaths reported t the press conference
because that misses deaths cos of reporting delays
A lot of Monday’s deaths don’t get included until Thursday etc.
You have to get PHE- pears : “reconciled figures” that account for reporting delay
So for deaths upto April 10
They take the cumulative figure announced on April and addin the deaths that happened before April 10, but weren’t reported until April11,12, 13 etc.
The ONS-apples
“there were 12,516 deaths involving the coronavirus in England up to 10 April (and which were registered up to 18 April).”
The PHE-pears
NHS England reported 10,260 deaths in hospitals in England for the same period”
The difference of 2,256 is the total deaths involving Covid19 OUTSIDE hospitals
That’s 22%
So 78% of CovidDeaths till then had happened in hospital
Latest ONS figures. Basically, the deaths they can’t hide at the daily propaganda fest.
We’re at or around 23,000.
Would that be about 35% higher?
13,121 deaths up to April 10 v official government hospital only 9,288.
Roughly 41%
Venutias you are wrong
The official actual number of hospital deaths is not 9,288
that is the daily REPORTED-hospitals-deaths only.
It includes deaths that have been reported thus it lags reality cos many recent deaths don’t get reported until a few days after they happen
They later make another tally the reconciled tally about a week later of actual deaths on that day and that was 10,260
23,000 what’s that mean ?
Stats are not properly known until 2 weeks later when the ONS Death Certificate stats come in
Then a Covid death is WITH-Covid not just FROM-Covid
So far each week there are about 2,000 extra deaths/week from the effects of lockdown.
@V here is the ONS explaining that the two stats use a different metric
Now there is an interesting thing, when we get to a falling phase
which we might be in now
Today’s reported daily tally is 823
It is entirely possible only 600 people died in hospitals in the last 24 hours and that the other 223 actually happened a few days ago but have only just been reported.
We can can be sure that when days like that happen
BBC/Sky and libmob will not accuse the government of OVER reporting the daily tally.
Sg.
If the United Kingdom’s figures are underestimating the death toll by a similar figure, then the true death toll for the country as a whole one would extrapolate as 23,000 based on the latest data — making it the second worst hit in Europe behind Italy, just.
The lag phase between the ONS and daily hospital figures are confusing people (deliberately?). Look at the graph shown today at the press conference, it has 2 UK lines. Draw, with a pencil, where the ONS line gets to (on today’s date), then you’ll get it.
Im sorry, the strategy is wrong. Protect the NHS, do whatever you want Hancock, it’s a shit show.
Huw Edwards in last night’s 10 o’clock news omitted to mention the lengthy government rebuttal of the ‘journalistic triumph’ in the Sunday Times, listing the PM’s apparent failures.
Edwards simply reiterated the popular ‘Boris skipped five Cobra meetings’ line, while others compare Boris unfavourably with Gordon Brown, who ‘chaired every Cobra’ during the foot&mouth crisis. Well of course he did, desperate as he was to assume every trapping of PM’ish responsibility. It would be far more interesting to discover which relevant minister he forcibly deposed each time to ensure he was seen to be in charge.
Meanwhile Poor Old Polly is in full puff-adder mode for today’s Guardian, demolishing Boris for her audience who evidently live for her green ink outpourings. Perhaps it’s a sexual thing? The well documented successes with the ladies of priapic Boris must rankle by comparison with Toynbee’s rare sessions with a courageous Tuscan gardener, armed no doubt with a stout paper bag.
Apropos Gordon and those Cobra F&M meetings, I wonder how much his morose and obdurate bullying overrode informed opinion and influenced the decisions to slaughter all those tens of thousands of perfectly healthy cattle?
Possibly a reserve bag might be in order just in case hers falls off . . . ?
Heavens above Belters, that made me laugh. Outstanding work!
BBC used to have a sense of humour what changed?
“In an amusing anecdote, Mr Lundestad relates how he found Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, who won the award in 1994, watching an episode of the Tom and Jerry cartoon in his hotel with other Palestine Liberation Organisation members. “It was made very clear that they intended to watch until the end,” he said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34277960
Radio 4 : a care home boss said doctors are now not visiting homes and if a person dies, the care home has to sign the death certificate with the help of a doctor remotely..
Sharia social distancing: Unmarried couple found together in a hotel are flogged away from the usual crowd of spectators in Indonesia’s Aceh province due to Covid-19 concerns
Six people were flogged for violating Islamic law in the arch-conservative Muslim province of Aceh today
Only a few people were watching, in contrast to the large crowds of spectators who sometimes attend
Many of those watching were wearing masks, while the cane-wielding enforcer wears a hood in any case
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8240615/Indonesian-province-carries-flogging-indoors-coronavirus-pandemic.html
BBC “news” prior to daily conference, Hugh Pym, health correspondent, interviewing spokesperson re the news about many more covid testing stations opening – on the face of it a slightly positive piece of news – Mr Pyms first response……”We’ve heard from some NHS staff that these testing stations are difficult to get to and some people don’t have cars, how are they supposed to manage?”. Not any acknowledgement that this is a step forward. As I commented recently, I sometimes despair at the dreadful level of ‘journalism’, their theme tune seems to be “Always look on the bleak side of life…” (due credit to Eric Idle). Here endeth today’s rant, best wishes to all.
BBC “news” – “fake as a tranny’s fanny” to misquote DCI Gene Hunt.
“Coronavirus: Wales does not currently need 5,000 tests a day, says minister”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-52366831
Who was it said “Test, Test, Test”
Why Wales does not currently need a Welsh Assembly ?
Top HYS …………
“Labour fails the Welsh people yet again !!!
It’s been like it since the assembly was formed, disastrous. “
If you need a clear picture of why the BBC is so fixated on the NHS to the point of sycophancy this article or rather party political broadcast for the Labour Party by Zoe Williams in the Guardian explains all.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/21/coronavirus-crisis-ends-bad-for-conservatism
“No matter how this coronavirus crisis ends, it will be bad for conservatism…
The NHS was a socialist ideal – and now its role has brought about a paradigm shift in the political debate…”
So it makes no difference how well or not the NHS stand up to scrutiny after this pandemic, they are damaged by the Conservatives so if it goes badly it will all be the fault of the Conservative Government. If it goes well it will be down to the Socialist founding fathers.
Job done!
Zoe Williams launches her spiel under the entirely false premise that ‘…the NHS was a socialist concept…’
You’d have thought that someone of her immense depth of knowledge and political acumen might have known that the original concept was first discussed in 1940 by Churchill and Beveridge – perhaps she simply couldn’t bring herself to admit the truth, though that’s a common enough problem for Guardian writers.
Logical quiz for kiddies stuck at home:
“Private health care is to the British NHS as ITV is to the ….”
Fill in the blank by choosing one from the following:
(a) CIA; (b) M&S; (c) WHO; (d) TSB; (e) BBC.
Reuter’s on Tuesday evening provides an answer to where the Chinese virus comes from .
It reports that WHO says ‘there is no sign that the virus was produced by mankind – it came via a wet market ‘
So – on the basis that the WHO is an extension of The People’s Republic of China – we know it came from their laboratory . And they are using the WHO to butt cover .
Meanwhile it seems that China is running disinformation even more enthusiastically than the BBC
Fed- digg told us the Guardian (read bbc) view. Victory of Socialism. China has an extreme form, the West a much milder one. But it is a continuum.
In the USA we see -with astonishment- half the country on that continuum as well; where is McCarthy when you need him?
The West has not yet moved to the classic Socialist/Communist one party model, but much of the public mindset is in place.
Man has a spiritual component, and the dismissal of “religion” by the scientists has left the West without someone/thing to worship. Guess what we have promoted into that vacuum?
China has the herd in thrall of Mao; UK has the herd in thrall of…?
Now, I can immediately hear the objection. This is deep stuff. But look at the willingness of people to allow themselves to be locked down. Key to the control are the media. In the UK, key to the media control are the bbc.
It is not by accident, that we sit and watch the beeb present us with the propaganda briefings every single afternoon. Control by generating fear.
Our own version of Xinhua, the official press agency of the Chinese People’s Republic. Camouflaged in benign, caring wrapper, so must be good.
A small but typical piece of BBC bias on the R4 news circa 18:20.
The FTSE 100 was said to have fallen by a certain number of points, equivalent to 3% of its value. No problem there … only that similar or greater rises in recent days have NOT been heralded as 3% or 4% rises.
Can anybody here confirm my impression that we are much more likely to be told about FTSE falls in both numerical and percentage terms than we are about rises?
Mentioned before, but….
The BBC really show their true selves and their own agenda when, again and again, the latest C19 statistics on deaths and hospital admissions are first reviewed for comment by ……….their POLITICAL editors.
Not health, or social care, or even statistics, but POLITICAL.
Laura Doomsberg and Norman Smith know jack all but still gets first dibs.
Tells you as clear as day where the biased BBC is coming from.
Today’s press conference was, by any standards, perhaps the best yet in terms of informed opinion and fact. This in no small way was due to the quality of the questions towards the end of the session, which had the double benefit of making Peston and Kuenssberg seem petty and repetitive by comparison.
On which note, where the ‘Why don’t we make our own PPE?’ mantra is concerned, nobody seems to ask the obvious question of where the relevant material will be sourced – perhaps tents from Go Outdoors?
Also, what part do the bane of our lives, H&S inspectors, clip-boards at the ready, play in slowing the procurement process?
There you are BBC, two avenues worthy of your investigative skills.
Laura had a wee convo with Surkeer, as you do, and guess what… he came up with a killer sources who say quote…
#CCBGB
Market rate talent. Apparently.
Beltane – the manufacturing nation that I grew up in seems to have vanished.
Take cars: vivid memories of Austin& Austin Healey, Morris&MG, Triumph, Rover, Hillman& Humber, Consul, Prefect, Vanguard, Bentley, Rolls Royce (latter two were still UK owned in UK) There were many more, I can’t remember. Sure, one or two may have been owned by Ford. And is Robin Reliant still purely British?
All gone, either abroad or just into the ether.
Now we need to import masks from China and gowns from Myanmar.
Ah well, Nissan are made in Sunderland. Pity they’re Japanese.
This morning I shared another oddly pervasive lefty blonde who I think the bbc are happy to platform. Not all staff are impressed.
Guest – so add a minimum of 40% to the number of dead in hospitals .
Fedup2 s law says that the true number of covid related ( careful ) deaths outside hospital is x2 the hospital number .
This number will never be finalised because of doctors not mentioning covid on the certificate in care home cases .
Meanwhile the BBC fixation with its medical wing – known to punters as the NHS – continues …..
I really want to be proved wrong and have someone learned rip these assertions apart and tell me it’s not that bad.
Fed – there are undoubtedly many ‘good’ individuals in both the bbc and the NHS. The problem is human power. When an organisation grows bigger and bigger, creating ever more levels of management, becoming ever more powerful, it becomes an unstoppable juggernaut.
It is then open to individuals who have only their own power and wealth in mind, but forget that they are supposed to serve a common good, to abuse. And they forget what that is; objectives like quality, impartiality (bbc), service etc fade, as the people at the top build ever bigger, and more powerful and wealthy, empires.
That -incidentally- happened to “religion”. Spiritually inspired individuals had a message to give, end of. But humans built organisations around them, which ultimately detached themselves to pursue power and wealth. The original message died, as it was watered down, added to, ritualised etc.
So, what should you ‘join’? Who is right? Anglicans? Catholics? Methodists? Baptists?
So many humanly constructed organisations, many BIG, wealthy and powerful.
You could listen to individuals at the top of some and realise they are atheists. No doubt, well-intentioned, but atheists nevertheless. Lost sight of humility, simplicity, service and their original purpose.
Still good people there, but -like the beeb and the NHS- the organisation we call the church, has lost its way. Confusion, chaos, bewilderment, depression etc etc become common and ‘change’ becomes an end in itself.
Fake – I’m gonna have to think a bit about what you say . Having been raised on organised religion – and being very good at RE ! I’ve seen the good and bad ….
Anyway whilst I’m thinking – it’s time I lifted up the cover on the new thread ….
Fed – Neither of what you mention are necessarily a problem. I spent a while in organised religion and was OK at RE.
Nor is what I said a judgement of any individual within those structures. If I judge actions, the context is purely a worldly one. The rest is not for me to judge.
Thread.
See that is AF Neil coming out against someone who pushes the 41% claim
Without her sarcasm Laura Kuenssberg is just plain
bland. I wouldn’t be surprised if her “controller”
had told her to cut down on her sarcasm , because
she was sounding like she was Lord Haw Haw
asking questions about UK policy during the second world war.
Let’s see if her side kick Hugh Pym also cuts out the sarcasm.
The beauty, Robert Peston has a go at the remainers and the BBC for getting their coverage wrong on Brexit
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1271745/brexit-news-robert-peston-swipe-remainers-project-fear-spt
His words…
“It is the role of a journalist to say, ‘we’ve got these two contradictory arguments, I’m now going to advise all of you which is likely to be closer to the truth.’”
He argued that the BBC did not inform viewers who was the “loony” (Leave) or the “genius” (Remain) in Brexit debates during the referendum.
On things in general vis a vis reporters he says…
“Impartial journalism is not giving equal airtime to two people one of whom says the world is flat and the other one says the world is round.
“That is not balanced, impartial journalism.”
My take…
“We’ve got these two contradictory arguments, I’m now going to advise all of you which is likely to be closer to the truth.’” (because I know about these things and I am right)
“Impartial journalism is not giving equal airtime to two people one of whom says the world is flat and the other one says the world is round.
“That is not balanced, impartial journalism.”
(but that IS exactly what balanced, impartial journalism IS FFS, telling the whole story and letting the viewer hear all sides and deciding for themselves)
This article encapsulates the whole problem with the MSM and especially the BBC and ITV. The viewers are assumed as so many sheep and it is therefore the media’s job to explain how they must think.
Not to mention that he totally overlooks the massive bias pro-remain demonstrated by most of the MSM and especially the BBC.
Looks like the BBC’s latest editor has decided she needs to say, er, something…
This explains why Greta has been silent for a while.
She’s spent the last few weeks learning everything there is to know about running a country.
Sorry if this has already been covered, but I would like to know if this has been reported in the UK press and who is responsible. Over 50 5G cell towers have been torched. One was near a Birmingham field hospital for coronavirus patients. There have been 3 arrests. Also there have been Telecom engineers have been abused some 80 times. Also in Europe but the center of this trouble is the UK.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/conspiracy-theorists-torch-5g-towers-claiming-link-to-virus/
LynetteO,
We’ve had some coverage and if I recall, some prosecutions. Regretfully no electrocutions.
We also have a few red-faced celebrities who ‘used their platforms’ to spread the fake science.
This explains why Greta has been silent for a while.
She’s spent the last few weeks learning everything there is to know about running a country.
Rejoice ye brethren, for the season of ill will and bombings is nigh upon us. Yes, it’s Ram-a-van again. I wonder what this year has in store? Car attacks, bombathons, arson in churches, fires in tower blocks from late night or early morning snacks, illegal public gatherings that the authorities and the beeb will turn a blind eye to?
Or programmes on how hard the muslims have it, how glorious the religion of peace is, or perhaps calls to prayer by the muezzin, eagerly broadcast on BBC radio?
So much to look forward to.
Lynette -I don’t know the answer, but I think abuse and criminal damage are OUT.
Above I spoke a little about confusion, chaos and bewilderment. Now we see what can happen, when people are no longer guided by morals and ethics, and are quite unable to think for themselves. States and their governments frequently rather like people who don’t think for themselves, and are not vigilant in seeing what they get up to, until it’s too late.
For what it’s worth, I suspect the 5G link to China may be a causative factor.
Of course, our governments are partially to blame, by allowing Communist China to extend its tentacles everywhere and into everything. Really a bad idea, but not solved by burning masts.
Perhaps people think the masts affect the ‘ether’.
If you want to know what that is, look it up. If you like reading, go for a short story by Arthur Conan Doyle, contained in “The Lost World”, entitled ‘The Poison Belt’.
I think you may find it interesting and informative. (And no, it’s not about Sherlock Holmes)
Does the government Science Chief read our blog ?
Pears and Apples who ever talks about that type of comparison ?
I’d never heard it before
It’s always “don’t compare apples with oranges”
This morning I realised the SkyNews report got a hyperbolic 41% number
by comparing the Public Health England’s : Daily Reports Hospital
Deaths to the ONS Death Certificate stats
which is wrong cos PHEs Daily stats don’t describe deaths that HAPPENED on the same day
So I labelled that PHS stat “Oranges” and the ONS stat “Apples”
I then explained
that there is another PHS stat that does describe deaths that HAPPENED on that same day; the “reconciled stat”
I labelled that pears
I then tweeted that at 3:14pm and posted it here at 4:01pm
and biked to town
On the way back I listened to the Chief Scientist refer to the two stats as apples and pears
.. and saw the Twitterati were saying “what’s he mean by apples vs pears ?”
I suppose it was a coincidence.
Stew – “Once is happenchance, twice is coincidence, the third time is enemy action.”
Now where does that come from?
I think it may have been Ian Fleming? What he meant by that?
Anyone flight tracking the A400 ?
When it reached Instanbul Monday night they turned the transponder off
Later someone one tweeted
#BREAKING The other two #RAF aircraft routing for #Turkey to pick up vital #PPE for the #NHS are an A400 and a Boeing C-17! They are both overhead Turkey as of 22:35 GMT.
There’s been no news since then
BUT There is a Heathrow tweet
2 people including BBC journo have reported SOME progress
Don’t worry if you can’t find the flight number. It’ll be very easy to spot on the flight tracker website.
Just look for a plane being followed by the BBC helicopter.
Stew – it was t the only a400 there either – I mistook a Turkish one on a training flight for our brave boys who have probably had enough of Turkish coffee . I wonder if it’s comfortable sleeping in one of those ?
The Peter Whittle show interviewing anti-lockdown man Peter Hitchens
…. turn up the spped to 1.25 or 1.5
Youube Dr Vernon Coleman
..is also against lockdown
Vile using every EdGud trick in the book for this one.