492 Responses to Midweek 10th January 2024

  1. Deborah says:

    First again.

    I am watching Mr Bates and The Post Office on ITV catchup. I wish this drama had never had to be made. I know it was recommended on the previous thread. It is excellent.

    Shame the BBC can’t make dramas of this quality.


    • Fedup2 says:

      Deborah – the public fury about the post office shows no sign of calming down thank god – but it will – and perhaps those such as vennells will continue on their top table careers …. Or maybe there maybe a widespread revulsion about the hugely paid highly rewarded ruling class moving from one non job to another whilst workers worry about a 2% NI cut … it would be a good theme for this election year ….


      • Deborah says:

        Inga Beale, CEO of Lloyds of London, Paula Vennells of the Post Office, Alison Rose of Nat West and Sharon White of John Lewis, they really aren’t helping the case for women in senior roles, are they?


        • BRISSLES says:

          Deb, I’m struggling to think of any woman in a top job that’s made a success of it – oh wait, yes Sue Barker in a Question of Sport.


          • Zephir says:

            Elizabeth I

            but she did have to cut a few heads off

            Unfair advantage in my opinion but a perfect way of dealing with the civil service… not too many working from home

            get thy laptop and iphone into the tower

            now that’s what I call hybrid working


        • markh says:

          Deborah- neither does that female head of Aviva who puts obstacles in the way of recruiting white males.


        • Up2snuff says:

          Well done, Debs on your first place. You’ve got to have a go at three in a row. We will cheer you to the rafters if you achieve it!


          • Deborah says:

            Thanks Up2, I will try my best but I don’t expect any special treatment for being a woman (I did get special treatment at university because I studied a male dominated subject, but it was a long time ago. I accepted it with good grace).


    • tomo says:

      BBC: “Post Office data unreliable” in 2003.

      … cover up and shoot the messenger

      Still, I daresay that a single sheet of A4 would suffice to print out the core problematic features of the Post Office software and its operation.

      The constant referring to “Japanese software” is odd as that seems very, very unlikely.

      I worked briefly for an ICL division in the 1990s and found alternate employment as soon as discovered what they were like…



      • Zephir says:

        Everyone should try Capita at least once in their careers to see how things should never be done

        multi million pound contract with Barnet council providing “IT solutions” and everyone having to using the free wifi from Barclays bank down the road….

        6 weeks sitting at a desk with no working computer or phone…

        the first thing you are told by Barnet council: get in the queue before 9 AM with your laptop not working otherwise it will take all day

        workers who do things versus managers “managing the contract” 1 : 10

        I warned a friend of mine but despite that he was recruited by Capita 4 weeks ago, still filling out their plethora of forms with the same information over and over, each going to a different manager, meant to start on Monday, now deferred for more forms


        • Fedup2 says:

          Zephir – ok – you got me . I am no techy – but I was working for an outfit which had been working on a new techy project for years – shed loads had been spent. But a month before ‘roll out ‘ I got the project .

          I took about an hour to work out it was a shower of crap . I then worked 18 hour days to fix it . The problem was the techy would be far more popular than the assumptions – meaning the puter would crash as soon as it fired up . So I got the techy bods to fix some wiring and got the system to work on day one .
          People loved it – I got a sense of satisfaction but no money or CBE although I deserved something . Life it tough . Anyway – my message is – have some doubt about technology – and the people designing it …..


      • atlas_shrugged says:


        You are spot on. I too remembered the ICL connection. Trying to pin this on a Japanese firm that had taken ICL over sounded a bit *waycist* IMHO. It reminded me of Obama blaming the Horizon oil well disaster on BP when it was a US Company Haliburton who did the drilling.

        Back on the subject of rouge Post Office computers – it is not just the software that can be bad. I remember back in the day finding a hardware bug in a processor called the 6502 which ignored a break instruction when an NMI interrupt also occurred. Translating this into plain English this would be like a computer ignoring an instruction to credit an account with £10,000 when the front doorbell had been pressed. The 6502 processor was used in the Apple II and BBC Micros. I have no idea what processor was used in the Post Office terminals.


        • tomo says:

          My recall of the situation at ICL was that as a near government department and having recruited via the old boy network and seemingly stuffed management with incestuous mix of ex forces NCOs and ackshual officers they were extremely dysfunctional with only a small core of technically competent folk.

          iirc my employment coincided with the exposure of the RAF’s Chinook FADEC fiasco and I remember think at the time that there was a lot of similarity between how that was handled to how ICL went about their business…

          I had hoped The Register would do a better job than they have on the ICL-Fujuitsu Horizon debacle but the site is a shadow of its former self.

          Computer Weekly does a better job


    • MarkyMark says:


      ** Congrats Deborah!


  2. Deborah says:

    Without a trace of irony, Milly Poddlehurst (sorry Polly Middlehurst) followed the story that it had been the hottest year in 100,000 years, with an item saying it is forecast to be exceptionally cold next week.


  3. Guest Who says:

    Where will all the electric cars be charged?

    From the look of it, Malibu.


    • MarkyMark says:

      Comment … “Cars parked for hours outside other peoples houses so the resident can’t park or charge their own car outside their own house. Wait for the inevitable vandalism and fights in the street.

      It might theoretically work on paper, but the whole thing was devised by people who don’t live a normal everyday life.”

      “Don’t forget those getting sued from leaving trailing cables everywhere for overnight charging…… Farcical is an understatement i quite agree”



  4. MarkyMark says:

    An IT expert has criticised the Post Office for ignoring his report which found “concerning discrepancies” in its software more than 20 years ago.

    Jason Coyne, who worked for Preston-based Best Practice Plc at the time, was instructed to examine the computer system called Horizon in 2003.

    He said he notified the Post Office the data was “unreliable” but he was ignored, sacked, and then discredited.


    The Post Office said it was doing all it could to put right the wrongs. – suicides? suicides? suicides? suicides? suicides? suicides?


    • tomo says:

      We’re still not there yet with what was actually going wrong with the software and more specifically the humans controlling the software…

      ‘How’ is important – but 2 decades of cover-up and shooting messengers…. ?

      Some pensionectomies and other financial penalties against individuals seem entirely appropriate.

      And remember everybody – the strongest passwords in the world are not going to protect you from malign actors who are running the system.


      • tomo says:


        • Fedup2 says:

          Apparently Jenkins didn’t get a bit part in the ITV show but his ‘expert witness’ statements were used in court to convict postmasters ….
          I reckon his lawyers -legal team – ugh – have told him to be silent as he faces a big perjury charge – he apparently is claiming he didn’t know what his statement wouid be used to or what an ‘expert witness ‘ is –
          He seems to be the one who got those people convicted …. Good luck in the future mate ….


      • atlas_shrugged says:


        > And remember everybody – the strongest passwords in the world are not going to protect you from malign actors who are running the system.

        Again you are spot on. Every single camera in the uK is made by the Chinese who almost certainly have a back-door capability. This means that at any time our CCTV cameras can be controlled by an outside power.

        What do you do if your accuser is a load of 1’s and 0’s?


        • tomo says:

          back door?

          feck… some of them don’t even have a handle on the front door ! – just push!

          More concerning is the avalanche of smart gadgets that communicate to Shenzen or where-ever when you use them – smart sockets, smart thermostats, smart speakers etc., etc. The voice assistants too – Alexa and so on aren’t exactly known for being careful with *your* data…


    • taffman says:

      “Post Office scandal: ‘Racism affected how we were treated over Horizon’ ”
      Uh ???


    • Thoughtful says:

      Its version of putting right the wrongs is to instruct greedy weasel to defend their position, because they still believe every decision they made is correct and haven’t reversed a single one unless forced to do so by a court.

      The greedy weasels are making more money out of this than the sub Postmasters are receiving in compensation.


  5. tomo says:

    I didn’t know we had one…




  6. tomo says:


  7. tomo says:


  8. Foscari says:

    Surely there is somebody in a responsible position at
    the BBC who can overide the cabal of anarchist
    Marxist who insist that the BBC is the media partner
    of Hamas in the UK.
    How many more lies are the BBC going to apologise
    for. By treating everything that Hamas tells them is gospel?
    These Marxists should join Owen Jones at Novara Media.


    • Fedup2 says:

      Oh Foscari – when you ( anyone ) uses the word ‘surely’!

      The ‘person in the responsible position ‘is part of the Marxist gang running the BBC / OFCOM …. They are as fireproof as the post office – with politicians looking away ….


  9. tomo says:


    • Zephir says:

      This is why this site exists, maybe an echo chamber as a couple of trolls have commented and then disappeared,

      for the precise reason that injustice and affronts to democracy, taking place in plain sight, are never called out.

      bbc “holding power to account” so keen to tell us, and Challenging misinformation hmmm:

      Kamala ? Biden ? Bidens son ? Clinton ? Savile ?

      the person in charge of the Crown Prosecution Office (Keir Starmer) during the Post Office scandal and muslim rape gangs ?

      Now there above is a veritable trove of subjects for a journalist to investigate…

      bbc…. tumbleweed, look a squirrel


      • Zephir says:

        Dancing on ice in a jungle, while watching a muslim baking something, who is, apparently, so ashamed of her hair to the point she has to cover it up, unlike the tens of thousands of women in Iran who celebrated not having to do the same


        • Zephir says:

          NO questions from the bbc who so often talk about women’s rights


          • Zephir says:

            The poster girl for muslim misogyny

            I can’t wait for her next show with some of the bbc gays finest, how will she contain herself without a rooftop to chuck them off ? what a game show that will be

            bbc muzzies versus gays and wimmin

            first one to chuck a grown male saturday morning radio 2 presenter who talks like a 13 year old girl off the roof ?

            I might watch that

            I have had similar thoughts on a long journey in the car


            • atlas_shrugged says:


              > off the roof

              I am thinking that Gaza will soon be a safe space for gays because there are going to be no high-rise buildings left to throw them off.

              Maybe this concept needs to be sold to the bBC. ‘Making safe spaces for gays’ (c) The IDF


    • MarkyMark says:

      HA HA HA HA HA HA!



    • Guest Who says:

      Nads going to get a show cooking around Saudi?

      “Chop chop square meals in Riyadh”


    • MarkyMark says:

      Born in Luton to a Bangladeshi family, Nadiya has been baking for 10 years.

      Fact title Fact data
      Nadiya now lives in Leeds with her husband and is a full-time mum to their three children.

      After wondering why her father only served ice cream for dessert at his restaurant, as desserts aren’t a big feature of mealtimes in Bangladesh, Nadiya was encouraged by a school home economics teacher to develop her skills and now delivers beautiful masterpieces at family occasions.

      Having put her career on the backburner to raise her family and with their support, she now feels inspired to have her own adventure – and make them proud.



      STACEY DOOLEY visits Protest in Luton Where she comes across a group of Muslim Extremists


  10. atlas_shrugged says:

    Not the bBC but the WHO are destructive mad marxists just like them:

    “Of the 21 members of the new group, at least half are trans. Others are affiliated with WPATH, and still others have “pioneered” medical sex changes, womb transplants, or child sex changes. The group includes two former presidents of WPATH, the World Professional Association for Transgender Health, which in their latest guidelines stated there should be no age-limit on sex changes for minors.

    Ashley, a criminal law assistant professor at the University of Alberta is on board with that, believing that “puberty blockers ought to be treated as the default option” for all minors, regardless of gender identity, so that kids can “choose” their gender instead of growing up naturally and without intervention because natural development “strongly favours cis embodiement by raising the psychological and medical toll of transitioning.””



  11. Fedup2 says:

    BBC News – through grinding teeth – having to report that Obama Biden had no idea the 2nd in command of the US military was in hospital for 7 days ..! And it looks like no one noticed ….


  12. Fedup2 says:

    Sadly – an ‘event ‘ will occur which politicians will use to distract us from the horror of the post office – which should become a wider examination about the corrupt dirty self service mediocre board types who infest quangos – health trusts – other public bodies -filling their CV s and bank balances …


  13. Fedup2 says:


    Don’t you love a BBC disconnect ? They sent a kidult to some technology show in the US … great AI crap …. For some reason the post office computer system – Fujitsu- didn’t get a mention …. Nor the list of computer failings and taxpayer rip offs across the year …


  14. micknotmike says:

    Front page (Of course) on the bbc, “Racism affected our treatment in the horizon scandal”. I don’t know which angers me more; the fact that certain ethnic groups will jump on any chance to play victim if there’s is a few quid to be made, or that the bbc jump on any chance to plonk any whining minority front and centre.

    This will backfire on both groups, of course. Regarding the bbc I’m now firmly in “In the name of God, give it a rest” mode. Regarding the “wronged” ethnic groups, I now avoid interacting with them in any way, whether at work, in shops, in any aspect of life. I used to be (Reasonably) tolerant, but now I’ve had it with the lot of them.


  15. Zephir says:

    I am led to believe that an O level grade C is equivalent to a GCSE grade A

    go figure

    bbc staff should be required to show their qualifications before they are allowed to rant


    • moggiemoo says:

      An ability to speak and/or write some form of recognisable English would also prove useful.


  16. Zephir says:

    From her Linkedin profile, one might surmise, thick as shit, an expert on something or other

    Bachelor of Arts (B.A.), French and Russian

    Sutton High School
    French, Spanish, History, Chemistry

    Activities and societies: Head Girl

    Marianna Spring
    United Kingdom

    Honors & Awards

    Ronnie Payne Prize for foreign reporting
    Geddes Trust
    Feb 2017
    Sixth Form Academic Scholarship
    Sutton High School
    Sep 2012
    GDST Anne Hogg Cup for Modern Foreign Languages
    Sutton High School
    Jul 2011
    Best Article Award
    May 2011


  17. Fedup2 says:

    BBC news reports the moans of some Albanian who topped himself – the moans were about the food – the Wi-Fi ( yes really ) and the ‘cold showers ‘ on board the ship being used to house unlucky third world invader criminals ….

    Apparently the dead Albanian has made it home to Albania in a box …


  18. taffman says:

    “Stop the boats” ,


    • Zephir says:

      Hiow many boats are arriving in Wales ?

      there might be a reason

      I did waste some time there until the roads got smaller and smaller and then we ended up on top of a hill-with welsh farmers shouting at us


      • taffman says:

        Not boats but busses.
        They arrive in taffland from England in busses and are put in 4 Star hotels .
        Them hill farmers are very ‘touchy’ about their sheep. Perhaps they mistook you for a sheep rustler?
        Perhaps its best you stay out of taffland ?


    • Fedup2 says:

      I wonder who picked up the tab for sending the Albanian in a box home …?


  19. Guest Who says:


    Wait until Nads and Clive Lewis demand go to check behind the bike sheds behind the local compy for WiFi.


    • MarkyMark says:

      “They’ve run out of hotel rooms, are kicking kids out of school for illegal housing and now they want your homes too”


  20. Fedup2 says:


    Ok – I admit it – when our Justin isn’t bored with the drudge of ‘toady ‘ he can turn into a journalist . In the 0810 interview his victim was the hapless blue labour ‘minister for the post office ‘.
    I bet he got the job because number 10 thought the gig was an easy one – well it ain’t now …

    The victim tried to remember the ‘press brief ‘ but floundered . His worse comment was ‘we don’t want trial by media ‘ – at which our Justin – of course – said the whole affair is now front and centre just because of a TV show …. Poor old MP was sinking …. blaming a ‘previous government ‘ for giving a gong to the corrupt CEO … – hang on – it was the blue labour government …
    BTW – we still don’t know who signed it off … maybe the dishonours system really needs dumping … but the ruling class will never do it to themselves – they all fantasied about their peerage – see £ Michelle Moan £…


  21. andyjsnape says:

    Ecuador: Gunmen storm television studio live on air

    Maybe the supporting bbc of the illegals arriving daily to the UK, could do the same with the bbc


  22. andyjsnape says:

    The post office is racist

    Racism affected how we were treated over Horizon, says Post Office victims


    • Guest Who says:

      Luckily the South Asian outrage industry is right on it.


      Which means Vile is coming, then YAB, then….


      • Guest Who says:

        The % of subpos from various demographics need investigating, along with media gobs.

        Than how many have offed themselves.

        Anyhoo Nads is now indulging in some luvvie on luvvie fire with that beastly Semite Fry.

        Bears and hats, apparently. She is a busy gal.


      • Guest Who says:

        Nihal getting in the Saudi minister on Gaza for BBC Brown Network too?


        Or has Mishal baggsied him?


        • StewGreen says:

          BTW Nihal’s Twitter bio is POLITICAL
          ‘The meaning of WOKE is aware of and actively attentive to important societal facts and issues (especially issues of racial and social justice)’
          That;s false cos what counts is common usage
          Woke meant that 30 years ago
          but these days Woke means someone who places virtue signalling above true justice
          eg caring about black lives when whitey is at fault
          but not when another black is
          Same as caring about Muslim lives only when Israel is at fault.


        • MarkyMark says:

          Labour Luton North MP
          wants Parliament to adopt the APPG Muslim group’s definition of Islamophobia.

          Many people say an Islamophobe is a person who has read too much about it.

          The late Christopher Hitchens said “the most toxic form that religion takes is Islam.”

          He came to that conclusion while researching his 2007 book “God Is Not Great”.


          “…and it shouldn’t have been our high commissioner (UKs) called in by the Pakistani Government to be lectured, we should have pulled in the envoy of Pakistan here and said ‘Stop that right now (protesting by blowing things up), or do without the aid we give you (Pakistan) …'”
          – Christopher Hitchens had a point in 2007


    • tomo says:

      You have to assume that there’s widespread disappointment across the BBC that there’s no blokes in wigs ‘n lipstick among the sub postmasters?


      • Guest Who says:

        BBC casting a sequel with Grayson in Face of Brown?


      • Foscari says:

        Tomo- I expect that BIG BROTHER from the diversity department is
        on this right now. I see that that the BBC have involved their
        “inclusivity ” imaging partners Getty’s in on the act. You
        know the Getty’s, who supply 90% ethnic imaging for cost of
        living features on the BBC.
        I am sure Getty’s will supply the right box ticking images for
        the BBC over the Posy Office scandal.
        Just a point and I expect I will get harangued for it. The Post
        Office scandal is the worse case of miscarriage of justice . And
        I suppose the Post Office will just have to accept that the
        sub-postmasters who were prosecuted for OTHER reasons than
        the Horizon debacle. Will, or have jumped on the band waggon.


  23. Flotsam says:

    Post Office Fujitsu Horizon sandal

    It’s being said that Smarmer as DPP could have intervened in the Post Office prosecutions. Much as I hate giving Smarmer the benefit of the doubt, was he even aware of the PO prosecutions, there’s thousands of prosecutions every day? The view he would have taken as a Lawyer in any case is that if they had a legal and valid defence then they would have been found not guilty, most of us are not that naive of course. Furthermore, are Post Office prosecutions private prosecutions? The Post office has Statutory investigation and prosecution powers so I’m not convinced that they would have been considered private prosecutions. Anyway, would he have thought the Post Office anything other than totally upstanding?

    Something to consider with the PO statutory powers is that their investigators do not need a Warrant to enter premises and seize anything they wanted in the course of an investigation. They are more powerful than the Police! The culture of the PO is that we are right.

    Someone touched on ICL yesterday without making the connection. Fujitsu took over ICL, a British computer company many years ago. ICL was the foremost provider of computers and services to the Government and big business in the UK. It’s why the Government still gives contracts to Fujitsu.

    The Fujitsu guy who is asking for immunity from prosecution in order to give evidence at the Inquiry is absolutely right to do so. I would say he could well be heading for prosecution, I wouldn’t give evidence in his position.


    • StewGreen says:

      Farage dealt with the Starmer issue yesterday
      .. https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1744820743454535833 (strangely video won’t load for me)
      #1 the CPS was directly involved as it took over prosecuting some of the appeals.
      #2 It is certainly not true that the CPS had no right to interfere in Post Office prosecutions
      It can take over any Private Prosecution it wants
      and that includes the special statutory power prosecutions the POst Office did

      In an ideal world CPS would have keeping an eye on the general pool of court cases and spotted that whereas there used to be a small amount of subpostmaster fraud there was a sudden magnitude jump.

      The Bridlington case was quoted this morning had the guy being accused of £25K of theft then being charged £310K in PO lawyer costs.
      That means that across the board law firms must have been earning millions from these cases , tens of millions maybe
      Just as the postmasters were the multimillion pound losers, the lawyers were the multi million pound winners.
      So they knew the magnitude of the change
      And if ll those lawyers knew the magnitude
      surely the CPS must have realised and one of them should have asked ..”Are these prosecutions kosher ?”
      cos asking questions about such discrepancies is part of normal management.

      Taxpayers will fund handouts to postmasters
      but will profiting lawyers be refunding anything to taxpayers ?


      • Fedup2 says:

        Stew – in common with politicians – lawyers are amoral – they care less – only self interest motivates – I’m sure even those politicians who bothered with the case across the decades were motivated by an ‘angle ‘…

        Lawyers -of course – are just motivated by money and beating the other side ….

        And starmer ticks both boxes ….


      • tomo says:

        Taxpayers will fund handouts to postmasters – but will profiting lawyers be refunding anything to taxpayers ?

        – SPOT ON

        – especially if the lawyers concerned knew that there was ‘summit dodgy about the PO’s claims.

        – goes back to my capital punishment comments about executing the prosecution lawyers if they fraudulized away and deliberately caused the execution of an innocent.


  24. StewGreen says:

    9am More Or Less I saw they would have an item “Did London gun crime rise by 2500% in one year”
    That’s easy ..of course not
    In February the Daily Mail made a silly mistake by picking one niche category of non-violent gun law breaking ..licence breaches etc.
    And they later corrected it

    But the prog as usual used th item put their own spin lines in
    “homicides in London are down to 100 half levels in 2003, with recent peak being 153 in 2019”
    .. Any omission ?
    They forgot to say more victims survive than 20 years ago due to better medical treatments

    Then said “serious stabbings has been rising but is lower than before the pandemic”
    Well if that is true that is good
    .. but note they chose to omit the actual numbers, I doubt they are down that much.

    Later item : Admiral insurance had a silly number about the number of missing cats per year 97 million.


  25. Jeff says:

    I’ve just finished watching the excellent, Mr Bates and The Post Office; absolutely superb, but what a horrible story…

    You know, being a “climate sceptic” I can see parallels between those maligned postmasters and folk in my/our camp.

    Both groups keep questioning the figures…the postmasters were told, “No, our computer tells us you’ve misappropriated £32,000, don’t question the Horizon computer.”
    “Climate deniers” are told, “No, our climate figures tell us last year was the hottest EVER! Don’t question the science.”

    Every day there’s some new green lunacy tax imposed upon us, pretending to save the lives of kids, grannies and the vulnerable. Actually, of course, it’s imposed to fill the coffers of parasites like Mayor Khan…a latter day Sherrif of Notinmyname…

    I’m told that “The Earth is on fire.” I venture into the garden, wrapped up like Captain Oates, and my little greenhouse is covered in ice and the lawn is stiff with frost..I’m shivering and there are brass monkeys looking very sorry for themselves, but…”we’re boiling”…

    Mr Bates didn’t trust the figures.

    Neither do I…


  26. AsISeeIt says:

    A not a good enough chief and too many Indians suffered edition (in which Mr AsI evolves his style)

    According to the BBC: Seven Post Office workers of South Asian heritage have told the BBC they believe racism affected the way people were treated in the Horizon scandal.

    On a morning when our BBC wavers on the verge of adding a new semi-permanent major subject header tab to their online news page – to sit up there with: Israel-Gaza War; Cost of Living; War in Ukraine; and Climate

    Post Office scandal

    Post Office scandal: What can be done about convictions?

    Fenny Compton: The village where Post Office scandal battle began

    Post Office scandal explained: What the Horizon saga is all about

    Post Office scandal: The power of the docudrama to bring about justice

    Devon woman jailed in Post Office scandal ‘had to leave children’

    Plus there’s the lastest BBC top headline: ‘My life was wrecked’: Post Office victims tell BBC impact of scandal

    Liverpool Hillsborough disaster victims say: Don’t forget about us! I jest of course.

    This was inevitable at some stage: Racism affected how we were treated over Horizon, says Post Office victims (BBC)

    Scratching around in the press looking for other news, we do at least find a couple of calm down dears

    Dress for your shape I’m a rectangle! – Anna Murphy in the formerly serious Times taking this trend of gender self-identification to whole new geometric level – in case you were wondering Mr AsI is a square – obviously… but he’s not a missionary for it. Should he rephrase that?

    You have to be so careful these days

    Scottish parents face jail if they stop children changing gender (Telegraph)

    To be fair the rectangle article is only teased on the front cover of the Times and appears in the female interest Times2 together with the somewhat conservatively expressed piece: I judge parents who hand kids their phones

    Having establish that tone of hang ’em and flog ’em needs must we return to the news media obsession du jour and whereas the BBC tends to concentrate on the victims (particularly the brown ones) the print press go for the fall guy (gal) and the general public’s main concern is likely that we just want to buy a stamp without having to queue for half an hour.

    Post Office chief to give up her CBE over scandal… Bosses accused of having ‘blood on their hands’ (Times)

    Token apologies and the taking down of the baubles, come the New Year, was never going to be sufficient recompence: Now give back your millions (yells the Daily Mail)

    The Daily Mirror reaches for their favourite and rather over-employed banner headline: Shameful.

    Boris Johnson tended to get a: Zero Shame… Gray report fallout (‘Partygate’ February 2022) from the Labour-supporting Mirror but oddly it was our PM boss girl Theresa May who was awarded the full blown Mirror: Shameful… Inhuman and cruel persecution of Windrush Brits (April 2018)

    Where were we…? Ah yes calm down dear

    Our baffling obsession with boobs Don’t be down when things start to drop Kate Lister (‘i’)

    And for balance – and to perk the ladies up a bit – here’s a steady on sir (or as London mayor Sadiq Khan might say: Maaate!)

    Jason Donovan’s bod at 55 – and his black nail varnish! Polished: Jason Donovan on Bondi Beach yesterday (Daily Mail) – Jason is your frontpage pin-up snapped in his Aussie beach appropriate budgie smugglers, no less.

    Getting down to the basics

    Daily Star: Men: You CAN wear your your grundies for more than a day… But experts say the same does NOT apply to women – one senses a feminist outcry about to explode

    The Times goes with their current thing frontpage pin-up: Paula Vennells… – which perhaps, despite all our boss ladies, goes to prove we do still live under somewhat of a male misogynist patriarchy. Who on earth advised the nation’s then top postmistress to do the glamour shoot? (Photo credit: Tom Stockill/The Sunday Times)

    Horses for courses – as the saying goes. Previously we had the Barbie-pink dressed Margot Robbie red carpet pic puzzlingly representing the movie Oppenheimer (she wasn’t in it) winning the Golden Globes (Guardian pin-up for presumably aesthetic reasons) and today we have: Kate’s winning fashion formula at 40… seven dress habits that have helped the Princess evolve her style… (Daily Telegraph)


  27. Zephir says:

    For you

    Jason Donovan tribute



  28. Zephir says:

    If you are pining for the past and need a good tribute band just ask

    I vividly remember as a music promoter making the mistake of putting the Bay City Rollers on stage in ther middle of the singers alcoholic episodes.

    All I can say is that there were a lot of middle age ladies who had always wanted to see the band and finally had the chance

    his voice was gone and carried off after a surfeit of jack daneiles

    his asian wife was nice though

    I could write a book about some of those experiences

    Hawkwind, don’t get me started on those false hippies,

    Tour bus driver. fat, severe chest pains ?

    lets call an ambulance..

    Brock oh its ok no need we have to be in Devon tomorow

    All I had to say was “do you remember the last scene in the Italian Job”

    “oh yeh”

    “thats you tomorrow”


  29. tomo says:



  30. StewGreen says:

    People seem to keep saying that ITV’s drama about the Post Office is a gamechanger
    To me that is a gigantic false narrative
    It’s an accident of timing that the scandal was culminating right now
    People were waiting for the inquiry processes to come through and then recently the PO has been continuing to drag its feet over getting compensation paid out.
    I didn’t particularly need Toby Toung’s acting to make me aware of it.

    I would actual praise the BBC for its many old progs about the scandal
    and Private Eye before that
    ( and I despise both of those orgs)

    eg this tweet is more than 10 years old


    • MarkyMark says:

      “I didn’t particularly need Toby Toung’s acting to make me aware of it.”

      * 650 MPS failed.
      * Media failed.
      * Councils failed.
      * Judges failed
      * Police failed
      * ITV Award ceremony is now the new go to place for justice! HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA !


      • StewGreen says:

        That’s mostly just useless sneering at people who weren’t involved
        It’s more like the Post Office management were hammering down on people
        Some judges did fail to stand up to the barrage
        but there were maybe some prosecutions where the judges did kick it out

        Private Eye and Computer Weekly are media
        and here’s Private Eye in 2011

        Their updated report for free https://www.private-eye.co.uk/special-reports/justice-lost-in-the-post

        BTW by blaming Vennels for all, iTV deflect attention from Adam Crozier who preceded her, and then moved to head ITV .. ,, he left there a few years ago.


        • Guest Who says:

          Trouble with the PE is it is so much happier sneering electively it has ceased to be a worthy read.

          Farage ‘says’ doesn’t make it true.
          The Post Office used private, not public prosecutions. Starmer was “Director of Public Prosecutions”
          @christopherhope you either know this but don’t care or, you ‘should’ know this.

          This lady’s bio:

          Jemma Forte
          Broadcaster 📺 | Writer 📚| Podcaster 🎧
          @jeremyvineon5 @bylinetv @skynews @thetrawlpodcast

          Given the places who hire her, I draw the reader’s attention back to:

          ‘says’ doesn’t make it true.

          Given that is the basis of most of their EXCL, BREAKING #prasnews


          • Docmarooned says:

            Exactly Guest. I recently cancelled my Private Eye subscription I had for years. It seems to mirror Hislops smug sneering attitude to anything he does not agree with. The final straw was their disgraceful anti-Israel response to the Hamas atrocities.


            • Guest Who says:

              typo: ‘selectively’

              I did a fair while back.

              Hislop is a very well paid media kiss of death now.


        • MarkyMark says:

          Interesting to see how many layers of people these things go through before ending up on NetFlix/ITV and being noticed.

          See Rotherham.

          From the link you added … “ONCEIVED in 1996 as one of the first private finance initiative (PFI) contracts, between the Post Office and the Benefits Agency on the one hand and computer company ICL on the other, the Horizon IT system had an unpromising start. It had been set up to create a swipe card system for payment of pensions and benefits from Post Office branch counters. But, as with most mega-IT projects of the time, it soon fell victim to over-ambition, management consultancy snake oil and the inability of a PFI contract to deliver a complex public service.”


      • StewGreen says:

        Marky MPs were involved FOURTEEN years ago and NINE years ago
        “MPs attack Post Office sub-postmaster mediation scheme”
        9 Dec 2014

        Date: 08.09.2009 Taro Naw, BBC Wales on S4C, 9.30pm
        As former postmaster Noel Thomas, from Anglesey, continues his battle to prove he was wrongly imprisoned three years ago, Taro Naw, Tuesday 8 September, BBC Wales on S4C, reveals new evidence supporting his claims that other postmasters faced the same fate across the United Kingdom.

        Clwyd West MP, David Jones, who has a similar case within his own constituency, says: “I’m sure something’s going on and the Post Office need to answer the questions that these people are asking. I am going to ask for a debate at the House of Commons.”

        BTW the 2012 Bates story mentions MP’s pressurising the Post Office

        BTW I spot Independent journalist Nick Wallis asking questiong a month before Private Eye Published
        and then going a local BBC show in November 2011
        Later the BBC brought him in to do a huge radio series The Great Post Office trial


        • MarkyMark says:

          ” I am going to ask for a debate at the House of Commons.” HA HA HA HA HA HA !


  31. Zephir says:

    The simple fact that is has been drawn to the public attention with the drama and the associated votes to address the CBS tells me that it not a false narrative.

    But, it is a sad fact that this is what it takes for justice to be done

    Kier Starmer head of CPS

    NEVER to be heard on the bbc


  32. The Mouse says:

    BBC Webshite headline (a moment ago 10.20 am) –

    Bibby Stockholm: Others may self-harm, says dead man’s roommate.

    So what you are saying BBC is that others may self-harm if they don’t get 4-5 star hotels, aren’t allowed to ‘disappear’ into the cities where they can join the illegal ‘trades’, if they don’t get opportunities need to rape, groom, steal, impregnate to get a passport, maybe blow kids up in Manchester, maybe attack homosexuals, etc.
    Not all of them granted but does anyone know who are the threats to UK citizens, the Government and the whole liblabcon are clueless. We must be due another ‘lessons will be learn’t’.

    By the way – Not others, but anyone may self-harm by listening/watching/reading the Anti-British BBC and taking it seriously.


  33. MarkyMark says:

    Sub-Post Offices ( 7 Nov 2001)
    David Heath: …to the universal bank, a measure of protection was introduced through the Postal Services Act 2000, and the past 12 months have brought the advent of new technology in our post offices, such as the Horizon system, which is now in place. That welcome raft of Government proposals did a great deal to allay the worst of people’s fears about what was happening to the post office network. People…


    Child Support, Pensions and Social Security Bill (22 May 2000)
    Baroness Hollis of Heigham: …, see this as an opportunity which will keep them afloat for the decades to come. That is why we are taking steps to protect the network. For example, we are investing nearly £500 million in the Horizon system which will computerise post offices. The noble Baroness, Lady Byford, asked whether it will be universal. Yes, every post office will be online over the next year even if they are…

    Oral Answers to Questions — Trade and Industry: Banking Services ( 9 Dec 1999)
    Alan Johnson: …TSB, enabling customers of those banks to undertake a range of transactions at post offices. It is intended that the Post Office will extend its commercial arrangements with banks; and the automated Horizon system, which is to be installed at all post offices, will have suitable banking technology to enable all Post Office customers to have access to banking services at post office counters.


  34. Lunchtime Loather says:

    Loving the way the BBC is desperately playing “catch up” with stories such as these. It must be quite painful knowing that your major rival got the story first. I can only guess why the BBC ignored it, but some of the reasons would have been these:
    1) A lot of the people are white
    2) None are overtly gay or trans
    3) It was an “England” problem
    4) Nothing to do with Climate Change
    5) No opportunity to promote the BBC’s agenda.


    • Guest Who says:

      Seems the cubicle gardens at w1a are suddenly excited.


    • Fedup2 says:

      Lunchtime – to be fair – the BBC did do at least one panorama on this back in 2015c- which is on YouTube …..

      … but for some reason this affair never got the traction it deserved – I wonder whether as soon as ‘post master ‘ or post office got mentioned collectively people just glazed over ….

      Was there a good investigative journalist and paper which really pursued this ? It seems not – buried in the private was not enough …..

      I was wondering how the suspects are feeling knowing what has happened now ? Did they think they’d get away with it because time had passed and no one was interested ?

      I know these creatures are a low form of human life either ignoring the consequences to their victims or using them for their career – but one can but hope they are feeling it – although Crozier and the Fujitsu ‘expert ‘ are beyond morality ….


  35. Guest Who says:


    To ensure that everyone could see that Turness could be trusted in everything she had to say regarding BBC trustworthiness, the speech was conducted as if she were answering questions posed by the BBC’s own Disinformation Correspondent, Marianna Spring

    It has long been a given that the BBc and ‘trust’ are mutually exclusive.

    Got something to hide? Get in Marianna… [check]


  36. Guest Who says:


    It has come close to REALLY serious so often it is as amazing as the MSM not noticing the XR founders manifestos and training videos back in 2018.

    Or, for that matter the politicians not being held to account by them either.

    ‘Dr’ Gail was flat out advocating every scummy trick in the Alinksy rule book to get media coverage, duly meekly provided by the BBC especially.

    She was also willing some idiot acolyte to pull a fatal stunt to ramp things up. So far none has obliged. Terrorism seems more likely. They live to see their name in every headline.


    • digg says:

      In which case the solution is clear… they have designated themselves as terrorists by their actions and declared war on innocent people in our society and therefore need to be handed suitable very lengthy sentences instead of a slap on the wrist…. 10, 20, 30 years etc.


      • Guest Who says:

        Best I can judge, few if any in media or politics checked or were the least bit interested in this and other materials from XR and its predecessor ‘Rising Up’ before or since.

        One day a deranged moppet is going to deliver what Dr. Gail and a ratings hungry media want and need.


        • Guest Who says:

          There is a slide on getting KCL to bow to ‘demands’.

          My alma mater now sends out students to make them about wars nothing to do with this country.

          The ‘Dr’ Gails are who run stuff now.


        • taffman says:

          Life’s too short to watch that video/lecture .


          • Guest Who says:

            Sometimes, good men are so appalled by what they sense is coming they do read, and take transcripts. And send to media, and pols. And get ignored.

            It is actually more of a briefing, and a frightening insight in what was allowed to happen.

            But if you are in a tl:dr mood, Thoughtful has the solution, promising a thoughtful YouTube ‘informed opinion’ speaking for a nation.

            The summary provided has some factual claims I am unaware of, and might not be more than opinion.

            Here’s more from a likely other side of the coin, that I would take in the same spirit.


            Best to decide for yourself rather than ‘what appears’ to others, especially via Wiki.


            • Thoughtful says:

              There’s nothing about targetting journalists in the video I posted, and clearly you haven’t watched it or you would have known that.

              You are aware Netanyahu has refused to allow the Hamas held hostages to be released?


              • Guest Who says:

                I often have to tell BBC subs that just because they need the hits, keeping folk guessing is a poor way to encourage folk to click or watch, especially when the source comes across as compromised.

                I was not aware of this refusal. I see you have posted a follow up. Any idea why it is not across every MSM title going?

                TBF, this is pretty much BBC 101: “…reports of a purportedly leaked document”

                And I never said what I posted was connected to the specific matter of journalists, but rather clearly the less than noble profession they inhabit.

                Which you’d grasp if you did not seem to have a tunnel focus on only what you want.


  37. G says:

    Rev. Simon Sideways. ‘Fraid he has it totally right.


    • Fedup2 says:

      I had the misfortune to by the book by the yank you came up with ‘black swan ‘ …. Events like 9/11 are east to identify as ‘black swans ‘ …. A few people would see them coming but I submit impossible to foresee the consequences …..

      … yet somehow there is speculation that the is an ‘event ‘ coming and that the wealthy are buying bunkers and islands – how very Epstein …..
      Can’t really criticise them – I’d do the same …. The next big event ? Dirty bomb ? Nuclear exchange – flu – solar burn out – market failure – EMP – fried technology – kind of favourite’events ‘ but maybe it’s the old Martian invasion …


  38. digg says:

    The BBC claiming they are running short on cash and are mulling axing some long running shows including the Richard Osman productions. Thus trying to blackmail the government to up the license fee no doubt.

    It’s not a cash problem BBC, it’s a content problem. Viewers are ditching your offerings in droves as you push ahead with your unbelievably naff and unrealistic diversity requirements. License fee payers no longer relate to your socially engineered output as it no longer represents their own lives and are consequently voting with their feet and wallets!

    Go woke…. go broke has never been so appropriate.

    As someone famous once said…. “The truth? …. You can’t handle the truth!”.


  39. Guest Who says:

    This is the start of a complex exchange. Takes in IT, legal, politics, etc.

    This post office software then 🤔

    I’m a Senior Software Architect of hugely complicated real-time critical systems.

    The stuff that made 999 calls work in the past. Or that allows your mobile to work seamlessly while driving down the motorway at 70mph.

    You work on complex, demanding customer requirements, producing a clean architecture that is resilient, scalable and maintainable. It gets signed off. Everyone is happy with the new design.

    But what happens then is that they take your idea and it gets watered down and down and down, due to time pressures and costs. Corners begin to be cut.

    And then it is offshored and implemented by (in their own words) poorly trained Indians in Bangalore.

    It is never properly tested, despite your complaints to Product Management.

    It is delivered way too early, despite your complaints to Product Management.

    And problems are hidden from customers and users, despite your complaints to Product Management.

    So yes, as an architect, I’d want immunity from prosecution to testify for the #PostOffceScandal


    I worked in one of the most fun (no longer), least publicly threatening (if impactful if good) industries there was. But there was a lot of money flying about, hence responsibility and… accountability. Total to the penny and second… accountability. So it was the ultimate service industry.

    Any project had several sign offs internally BEFORE it went to client. After that it had a few at client side, and I insisted if my name (as boss) was on there, the client side boss’ was too.

    We sent out NOTHING if we were not sure it could be done on time, and budget as agreed in contact reports of all stages and changes. Also signed off in progress.

    You don’t get the big bucks if you can’t take the big kicks.

    Many a CR saved a junior’s bacon and even agency’s when lowlife’s tried to pull stunts on BS they created. And juniors were backed to the hilt. Often to the stage of firing a client.

    I early learned that in anything, you do not agree to anything unless you are confident at that juncture on delivery. In fact we went further and started putting contingency warnings up front just in case to intercept attempts to fudge.

    Ironically, my missus has just found that out in the world of academia. Sadly I am not allowed to share my wisdom on personal safety grounds.


  40. andyjsnape says:

    US and UK navies repel largest Houthi attack on Red Sea shipping

    “The UK’s Ministry of Defence shared images of the HMS Diamond deploying Sea Viper missiles and guns” – can we see the shared images then bbc??


  41. Terminal Moraine says:

    Day 2 of Fauci’s C19 testimony to the House yesterday:

    “During his interview today, Dr. Fauci claimed that the policies and mandates he promoted may unfortunately increase vaccine hesitancy for years to come. He testified that the lab leak hypothesis — which was often suppressed — was, in fact, not a conspiracy theory. Further, the social distancing recommendations forced on Americans ‘sort of just appeared’ and were likely not based on scientific data.”

    The Republican-led committee grilling Fauci are coming up with awkward stuff so it’s best ignored. The man who said “a lot of what you’re seeing as attacks on me quite frankly are attacks on science” is now deemed less newsworthy to BBC Science than “Ralph Fiennes adds voice to campaign against 112-mile pylons route”.

    More here: https://oversight.house.gov/release/wenstrup-releases-statement-following-dr-faucis-two-day-testimony/


  42. MarkyMark says:

    Horizon Software – BBC to pay pack post officer workers BBC tax for not investigating using their BBC verify system!


  43. StewGreen says:

    I wonder if at a Post Office planning meeting the nineties someone said something like
    “It’s best not to put all your eggs in one basket, so although it would be more expensive we should give contracts to two different contractors, running about half post offices on each system”
    If they had done it that way they’d have been sure about the Horizon faults
    They’d have a player in the market who wanted to show up Horizon faults
    and they’d have had a backup plan.
    You’d set it up that if one contractor performed well, they’d get a bigger share of the branches, so you’d have competition all the time,


    • tomo says:

      In the 90s I suspect that decision taking management moved seamlessly between NHS and the Post Office.

      I heard a long form interview with Adam Crozier years ago where he described the constipated management overstaffing and more. iirc under Crozier’s tenure they culled over half of middle management.

      There was absolutely no interest from existing management in improving the Post Office’s services.

      The system needed gutting and start over …. I mean… The Post Office were in a position to be an Amazon – but they were a moribund bureaucratic state business….

      I hope that that ICL-Fujitsu (another bureaucracy) software guy gets a severe grilling and explains what happened…


    • Thoughtful says:

      It’s not the way it works. IT procurement so far as I know is a seperate government department dedicated to screwing up every single project they are ever involved in.

      The problems appear to be largely caused by toxic intransigent women with toxic femininity to be allowed to hold up entire programs with ridiculous and unreasonable demands.

      I can recall the NHS computer system which had to be abandoned because whilst medical kit which was relatively modern would communicate with computer tech, the older stuff wouldn’t, and certain women were allowed to dig their heels in, insisting that older tech was modified to modern requirements. With such a volume of diverse kit of varying ages it became not only impossible, but also unaffordable to do what they wanted and compromise was not a word Toxic Females understand, so the whole project had to be canned after wasting untold millions on it.


  44. Thoughtful says:

    Here is an informed opinion on the situation in Israel and Gaza. It’s an hour and a half long so it’s pretty in depth.

    The people of Israel clearly are not happy with the policies being implemented on their behalf. The excuse of this being about hostages has been laid bare with Netanyahu refusing to accept them back and demonstrations in Israel calling for Hamas to take Netanyahu in exchange for the hostages!

    It would appear from Wikileaks that Israel intends to push the people of Gaza into Egypt which Al Sisi has already said would be the catalyst for war.

    You really should watch the commentary for an alternative insight into what is going on.


  45. StewGreen says:

    Interesting that Nick Wallis’s blogposts back in 2011
    addresses both Ed Davy and Keir Starmer issues
    The idea that the CPS under Starmer should have been concerned about the Post Office prosecutions.
    Here the bit from one of
    The Post Office remains the only body in the UK to run its own prosecutions and campaigners think that if it had to use the Crown Prosecution Service, many cases would not have made it to court.
    The last organisation with such powers, Customs & Excise, was stripped of them almost a decade ago when it was found to have over-stepped the mark in several high-profile cases.

    Mrs Hamilton’s MP, James Arbuthnot, expresses a widely-held view when he says: “I find it very difficult to believe that all these sub-postmasters and sub-postmistresses are suddenly found to be dishonest, if the alternative is that it may be a public sector computer system which has gone wrong.
    We’ve heard of that before.” But postal services minister Ed Davey is washing his hands of the problem, simply re-directing MPs’ questions to the Post Office itself.

    Comments are interesting too


    • tomo says:

      “The Post Office remains the only body in the UK to run its own prosecutions”

      Not true

      The Environment Agency is a case where they do what they like…


    • Fedup2 says:

      Stew – we can play a sick game of when Ed Davey will say anything about all this in Parliament- he is due to appear before the inquiry later in the year I think …. But I wonder if he will still be ‘leading ‘ his crap party by then?

      This story will run and run …. But it will be interesting how long before the press / public lose interest in this tragedy ….


      • Guest Who says:

        Still trying to get to grips with what the party options are and relative standings are.

        BBC and its Verify kids are off the table as they still think the Limps are No.3 with a bullet ever since Thorpo took out an Alsatian.


  46. tomo says:

    The culture all of that helped to create within the Horizon development team was revealed by a former Fujitsu insider, who spoke to Computer Weekly in 2021. The senior developer, who worked on the project between 1998 and 2000, said, “Everybody in the building by the time I got there knew [Horizon] was a bag of shit. It had gone through the test labs God knows how many times, and the testers were raising bugs by the thousand.”

    He said Horizon should “never have seen the light of day” and that bosses at supplier Fujitsu allowed it to be rolled out into the Post Office network despite being told it did not function correctly and could not be fixed.



  47. Guest Who says:

    From a post on a Paul Homewood thread:

    Revolving doors
    Ex-Ofgem Director joins OVO

    I have just had another email from OVO, whop we inherited from SSE. It informs me that this time in 2024 they reckon I’ll owe them money so how about they get it in their bank now to avoid unpleasantness in a year’s time.

    I am prepared to give them a one month credit buffer.

    It will be interesting if OFGEN gets involved who gets to decide. Like OFCOM with the BBC.